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Dana Bennett's avatar

The complete stupidity and ignorance and just meanness of Bush-Cheney’s absolutely. They were nearly as bad and criminal as Trump. Then that second term - I barely made it to my classroom to teach the next morning after S COTUS completely illegally declared Bush the winner - again. I still wonder what we’d be like if the actual winner, Al Gore, had been allowed ALL his very legitimate. But another Bush (and Roger Stone) intervened. Am I still angry! Oh yeah

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docrhw Weil's avatar

You are quite right Thom, but people don’t seem to know or learn from history. A basic understanding of why the Iranians are angry at the U.S., based on our involvement in the 1953 coup, would explain a lot. But that event, among similar ones elsewhere, is not discussed in the mainstream media. “They hate us for our freedoms” was a quick and meaningless soundbite that Bush babbled, and it worked because it appealed to emotions, not logic.

I’m a geography professor who also spent some time in Afghanistan before the Soviets came. That was part of a much longer trip overland from France to Nepal, and then by ship, plane and car to Argentina before heading north by bus. And I continue to travel extensively.

And from my experiences in the 1970s I then came to the conclusions that one could expect two things about Afghanistan: Any land war there was hopeless due to the mountains, and any land war there was hopeless due to the resistance the people would give. (I also felt that overall Islam was building up to some serious anti-Western activities and that Iran was very shaky.) This was all well summed up by a man I met in Kabul who proudly showed me a road and said, “We beat Alexander the Great here!”

I still believe that when 9/11 occurred we had to go in there. The American people demanded immediate vengeance. There was no more question about that than there was after Pearl Harbor.

However, I said at the time that the only way this would work was if we went in and out fast. Perhaps following up with physicians, engineers and the like would then have been possible. But an inept thrashing around war was going to end nowhere. This was especially so in a culture which no “traditional” American bureaucrats seemed to understand and where the people were happy to pretend to go along while stealing everything they could. Throw in tribal and family connections and it was far beyond our experience. For me the only surprises were how long it took for Washington to realize how hopeless the whole thing was…and then utterly screw up the withdrawal.

I used to think that the one good thing about the Vietnam War was that it taught Americans not to get into such conflicts. If we hadn’t been in Southeast Asia our fighting would have been in Nicaragua or Angola or some other such place. But a new generation came of age and thought they could make the strategy work, “this time.” The same lies about Iraq were ones I’d heard about Vietnam, and the results were the same, if not worse; ISIS should build a statue to Dick C., as without him they never would have existed. But in any case, both wars have been shoved down the memory hole and are rarely discussed anymore. Maybe these disasters will be the end of such overt adventures, at least for a while, and if the empire goes bankrupt, for all time.

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