The trouble with your approach, Thom, is that it both takes too long a time AND, because of that, in the short term, alienates people like me who were once R's and are now independents. Beginning in this next election cycle we need more centrist candidates, not more left-of-center candidates.
Sorry, but to me being a centrist is like sitting in stagnant water that breeds bacteria. Where has it gotten us? Mounting poverty, homelessness, skyrocketing education and healthcare. We need the type of dynamism that Bernie, AOC, and Mamdani wield....
Well put Sophia, I have been hearing this argument for centrism like forever,especially from the never Trumper former Republicans, But they don't answer the question, what policies does centrism favor, how do they stand on economic justice, social equality.
It is because of centrist candidates and policies, that we are in the situation that we are in, centrists are ameliorators, concilators, bipartisan, and not fighters. Centrists have given in and given up, and that has enabled MAGA and Trump.
William, you certainly paint a gloomy picture of a future country in which there are only two possibilities, one run by the far right or one by the far left. History shows that, until Trump, that has not been the case, and I think one can make the arguement that Trump won in part because many people like me don't like the extremes of either party. My sense is that it is the centrists like me that either party has to capture, not the other way around.
Tell us then what are your policies, what do you advocate for, what do you favor.
How do you stand on regulating corporations, that they don't exploit and kill their customers?
How do you stand on the issue of Diversity, Equity and Inclusion. On gay rights?On civil rights?On voting rights? on discrimination?
What is it about liberal politics that you find so offputting?
Myself I am non partisan, but I registered Democratic to have a vote in the primary. But my objection to the Democratic party has been it's timidity, the fact that it slops at the same trough as the Republicans, that we could have had Medicare for all (single payor) were it not for Nancy Pelosi, Rahm Emanuel and the lobbying and money of AHIP (Association of Health Insurance Providers)
Sue, I think you have put your finger on the answer here. We need to stop talking with labels here and start talking about specific policies, particularly those that also help those "at the edges" of all parties,and who can benefit from them. Thank you!
Saying I am deluded Daniel is not an answer as to why it is psyops, just another insult.
Biden passed three, watered down, bills, The American Rescue Plan, the Inflation Reduction Act, and the CHIPS and Science Act.
They all passed because there were giant easter eggs in them for the donors.
And also, the Democrats had a window in which they could have solidified, a woman's right to choose, but they chose not to, instead they passed the Respect for Marriage Act (which I applaud, but they could have passed the Respect for Women's Act at the same time.
The reason is obvious, By the time the Respect for Marriage Act was passed, the nation's attitude had shifted on gay marriage, and also it turns out some of the large Republican donors, like Thiel, were gay.
That is not the case with Women's rights, 68% of America identifies as Christians, and Christians are most vehement about women's rights (and patriarchal supremacy)
Those bills are the best we could do. Perfect is the enemy of the feasible. The only was to get "perfect" is fascism.
The idea that the party isn't pure enough comes to us from the 1940s, when the Dixiecrarts split during the convention. They and the Soviets may have hated each other but both worked to split the party.
BTW, I still think we won. Psy ops. Voter intimidation. Did Trump admit that Musk stole Pennsylvania?
1. In most states, independents can't vote in a primary. Why be independent?
2. I agree we need to be a "big tent" to prevail nationally.
3. All politics is (and are) local. In some parts of the country the national message is toxic for local candidates.
4. These days, (s)he who controls VAT and VAN controls the Democratic party.
5. Based on my experience, Dems need to register and empower more voters. I had to run for my last position -- county Dem executive committee. A candidate who has a built in following can prevail at every level.
There aren't "left of center" Democrats anywhere to be found with the exceptions of Dennis Kucinich, Bernie, AOC, and now Mamdani. Calling Kamala Harris "radical left" is laughable. I wouldn't have voted for her if it hadn't been the Convicted Felon she was running against. Look what the "Centrist" Dems are doing to Mamdani.
Hope you watch C-Span, Judith. There are 98 members of the Progressive Caucus and they want what Bernie and AOC want:
Leadership:
Chair: Greg Casar
Deputy Chair: Ilhan Omar
Whip: Jesús "Chuy" García
Chair Emeritus: Pramila Jayapal
Vice Chairs: Lloyd Doggett, Maxwell Frost, Jared Huffman, Ro Khanna, Morgan McGarvey, Delia Ramirez, Jan Schakowsky, Lateefah Simon, Mark Takano, Rashida Tlaib
Executive Board Members At Large: Chris Deluzio, Veronica Escobar, Summer Lee, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, Bonnie Watson Coleman
Other Notable Members:
Alma Adams, Becca Balint, Suzanne Bonamici, Brendan Boyle, Cori Bush, Jasmine Crockett, Danny Davis, Madeleine Dean, Rosa DeLauro, Dwight Evans, Raúl Grijalva, Hank Johnson, Sydney Kamlager-Dove, Ted Lieu, Jennifer McClellan, Jim McGovern, Grace Meng, Jerrold Nadler, Ayanna Pressley, Linda Sanchez, Jan Schakowsky, Adam Smith, Rashida Tlaib, and Paul Tonko
Why do we need centrists to get (former) R's disgusted by fascism to vote against fascism? You think that if you sit out, or even vote R in your greater loathing for progressivism, that the fascists will leave you alone?
I’m a left leaning Independent who agrees with almost all the social issues but also understand the economic issues. If one of the parties does not deal with our national debt and deficit, we are not going to be able to pay off either. If we cannot pay our debt, it is possible we will lose our status as the world currency, which would be a disaster for this country. Trump is trying to generate income with his tariffs, that basically tax
the 98% of us while protecting the wealthiest from tax increases. But the Democrats have no plan at all. Create some kind of incentive plan so corporate leaders are motivated to invest in our country. Brainstorm ways to create new jobs as AI takes over hundreds of thousands of white collar jobs. Have contests that offer rewards for out of the box solutions! Make sure that the Democrat Precinct chairmen aren’t former MAGA infiltrating the Democrats. If the Democrats are addressing all of the salient issues instead of relying on social justice issues, they will become an irresistible force. The people want new solutions to all of the problems barreling down the pike at us! If the DNC cannot see that their platform cannot win because it does not address our most pressing problems, then it needs to hire or recruit people who are experts in solving problems! Trying to motivate people to feel sympathy towards others when they are afraid for their own and their children’s financial security is short-sighted, to say the least.
Also, why is no one lambasting the stupidity of the techno-oligarchic Christo-Fascist plan to turn our country into a feudalistic dictatorship with all the wealth held by a handful of billionaires! The middle class is the engine of the economy. Replacing middle class jobs with AI
practically overnight is just stupid. It will gut the middle class. Such a restructuring of our economy should take enough years that there is time for adjustment and the creation of new kinds of employment. What is happening is a power grab by
billionaire sociopaths with no concept of the responsibilities of governance! If the Democrats hire advertising agencies to clearly show how the oligarchic Project 2025 plan will be a disaster for this country, I believe people will wake up and fight for our Democracy!
I'm a longtime fan, Thom. As an old SDSer yourself, you may remember me, the only one elected TWICE to the NO, 66-68, then at the Guradian We're pretty much on the same page now, after a long detour in the 70s. You may want to invite me on the show for a dialogue-interview. Carl Davidson, carld717@gmail.com
I have been part of this in my county. It DOES NOT take long at all. I was approached by a progressive friend and asked to attend local meetings of our Dem CCC. I did so and within four months was on the board as secretary. All it takes is:
Be a registered Democrat for 6 months or more
Attend the meetings. In my county there are two per month in two different locations.
Take notes and ASK QUESTIONS of the board members during meetings.
Make yourself known by the above and speaking to individual members after meetings.
Force centrist members to resign their post by attacking them on their positions.
Run for that board position.
It can be a fast takeover done within a few months if you and others are persistent and gain a majority.
This happened in what was considered a somewhat 'conservative' county. It went for Bernie Sandes in the primary and general elections and has voted majority progressive since then.
YOUR INDIVIDUAL ACTIONS COUNT!!! Be part of a better U.S.A.
Sophia, I agree with Thom it is concentrated committed momentum we need. If the nation has the ability to focus and target people why can it not be done? As I was out running with my pup on Saturday I watched has hundreds of people organized to follow me, who knew what I had done in my home that morning, can be achieved working in a concerted effort to infiltrate and turn the Democrat Party progressive like the Concord initiative, might work.
Thom: you used the term slaughter in Gaza. That raises a question not asked, because it is buried in the visuals.
What should Israel have done?What should Israel do? Confronted with a hostile force that is on a religious war and demands nothing but the obliteration of the state of Israel which of course means genocide of the Jews.
hazi Hamad, a leader of Hamas, said in an interview with a Lebanese TV channel that the terror group will repeat the October 7 attack time and again until Israel is annihilated.
“Israel is a country that has no place on our land,” Hamad says in an interview with TV network LBC on October 24, which was published today by MEMRI. “We must remove it because it constitutes a security, military and political catastrophe to the Arab and Islamic nation. We are not ashamed to say this. Will we have to pay a price? Yes, and we are ready to pay it. We are called a nation of martyrs, and we are proud to sacrifice martyrs.”
The Hamas official also repeats the false mantra that Hamas did not intend to harm civilians, but there were “complications” on the ground.
Art 7, HAMAS Covenant and sahih 2925/2926, book 56, hadith 139 al Bukhari
"The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him. Only the Gharkad tree, (evidently a certain kind of tree) would not do that because it is one of the trees of the Jews." (related by al-Bukhari and Moslem).
Faced with that, what then is Israel's proper response?
Anybody?
Of all of the thousands of words printed and spoken about the subject of Gaza and Israel.
Not Haaretz, but the facts are muddled. Within Gaza, according to Arab sources, besides the occupation, there are clans fighting among themselves, trying to kill each other off. The PA opposed Hamas and Hamas is retailating against them...
I accept that now that the US hostages have been released, we should not be involved with Netanyahu. Last night we watched an interview with Samer Sinijlawi, a Fatah activist and political reformer, who has become a voice advocating for change in Palestinian society. He is a native of Jerusalem.
Samer joined the Fatah party in Palestine at the early age of 14 during the first Intifada. At the age of 15, he was arrested and had to spend 5 years in jail in Israel. After his prison sentence, Samer was elected as international secretary for the Fatah Youth. He was later elected as a head of International and Israeli relations on the Fatah Supreme Committee.
For over 35 years, Samer has worked tirelessly to build bridges, engage in dialogue, and fight for a future where Israelis and Palestinians recognize each other’s humanity. Samer hopes to end suffering as a political weapon to spread the courage to feel each other’s pain and to find a path to lasting peace for both Israel and Palestine.
Throughout the conversation, Samer explains his efforts to bridge gaps with Israelis, his call for leadership reform, and his bold stance against violence, even while confronting the harsh realities of ongoing conflict. He emphasizes the importance of understanding each side's fears and needs, advocating for mutual respect and a focus on constructive solutions. Samer's message is one of hope, calling for the Palestinians to take responsibility and make the internal changes necessary to secure a peaceful future.
He says they need an election in the West Bank and in Gaza.
He holds Hamas responsible for committing the population to mass suicide.
I saw you on Ali Velshi and was glad to see you mention E.Lansing and SDS (when my partner and I had lunch with you we talked about our both being at Michigan State and involved in the anti-Vietnam War protests in different ways at the time). I knew several SDS activists but wasn't a member at the time. I was in Social Work grad school and ended up as the leader of our protests. We were the second department to go on strike (after the Psychology Dept) following the Kent State massacre. Nursing was the third, thus all of Baker Hall had departments close so we put an "on strike" banner on the building. I had the heady experiencing of announcing our demands (along with other student leaders) to an overflow audience in the jam packed auditorium. We never met but were in the very same march to the state capitol building.
By the way, my partner is still in touch with the woman who came from Chicago with her husband to visit you and your team. I expect she is reading this.
As I refect back on those protest days and think about the protests against Trump and his dictatorship I am heartened in some ways and frightened in another.
What inspires me is that the student protests were a major factor (along with the U.S. losing) that led to the country getting out of Vietnam. While at the time we had high hopes we'd make a difference we didn't know that we would. However, LBJ wasn't a dictator. When the National Guard opened fire on students at Kent State the outrage resonated across the country and LBJ cared about this. He responded to public opinion.
Currently we have the closest thing to a dictator in American history. Now we have Trump's Gestapo thugs going after immigrants. The outrage coming from the liberal media and, to varying degrees, the public is like water off a duck's back for Trump, Homan, Bondi, Miller and his Hitlerian psychopaths. Trump not only doesn't care, but as a paradigm of someone in the Dark Tetrad (the Dark Triad plus sadism) he feels good about being able to terrify and hurt his enemies.
While Trump's Gestapo hasn't gunned down anybody, at least not yet, yesterday I went into what I hope was hyperbole mode about the chance Trump would deport his victims to a country where they could be killed. They'd be dropped off in a desert in a host country like South Sudan that Trump would pay big money to, and then it would be out of sight and out of mind as far anyone knew. Their fate would never be known.
There are people like a guy who said his name was Ryan who called in to a CSPAN show who support the shooting of immigrants. Trump has expressed fantasies of alligators in the Rio Grande and shooting people trying to cross in the legs. We have a sadistic president and sadists who support him. Now alligators come up again in his Alligator Alcatraz where his fantasy is them eating people who try to escape.
I agree that Democrats have to get their act together. But I despair that even if they do and take back both houses of Congress and win state and local races we may not even have a "next election" because Trump will have cemented his dictatorship and been able to establish total control. When I think of this happening, I don't think engaging in tradtional politics (and protests) can save us. The only hope I have is that if Trump comes close to pulling this off, declares martial law, and activates the armed forces against citizens, is that the true patriots in the military will effect a coup to depose him.
Hal, I am aware that those who protested that war like to pat themselves on the back for ending it, but in reality the protests evoked a reaction, reverse psychology, among middle America and they demanded victory and f...k them damned commie hippies.
What finally did the job Hal, is middle America watching aluminum coffins being unloaded , the daily body count and the 58,000 military funerals of their sons, brothers, uncles and cousins.
Middle America tired of the war Hal that is why it ended.
Middle Russia would tire of that war also, had they freedom of press and freedom of speech, and not the threat of prison or falling out of windows.
I don't see this as "a pat on the back" as if I want to glorify what we did. You are correct that there was pro-war blowback and that it coincided with the Hippie Era (sometime called the counter-culture) didn't help our cause. In fact, however some of us looked like Hippies (Thom with long hair, for example), but we weren't. I don't think so-called Hippies were a major part of the anti-war campus movement, nor were the Yippies ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Youth_International_Party ) for that matter. It wasn't even SDS. It was ordinary middle class students that comprised the majority of the movement.
I don't think the impact of the student protests should be minimized. We did have an impact on the eventual end, but so did everything you say.
The looming threat of the draft was another reason people turned against the war. Those of draft age and their parents didn't wanrt anything to do with a war which had nothing to do with saving democracy in America. The growing death count couldn't be hidden.
It also wasn't the protesting students but also how they impacted their families. Pro-war parents in many cases had to have been educated by their children.
When we weren't on the streets, the protestors educated the nation one friend or relative at a time. WE were the ones saying that the body count was never going to end because the war was unwinnable. We did the right things---the vets joined US not the HAWKS. Huge impact.
You are correct. I went from an anti-war protester- many arguments with my father (WWII veteran), but several years passed, and I began to think maybe Johnson was correct- escalate and get out.
In heated discussions with others, I realized that the MIC was in the war for the money, regardless of the body count. I then hit the streets in my Bay Area, San Bruno, CA neighborhood, going door to door to call for an end and bring our troops home. At one point, it was becoming tough because the San Bruno neighborhoods, I came to realize, were defense contractors and employees who got angry with me and said," You are too young to know what you are advocating." But by then, I was convinced we needed to reach out to these individuals and hope to make an impact.
One way or another, I began an activist role in small ways in my neighborhoods.
This is so important for people to realize. Over the years, I’ve noticed that small town school boards have been infiltrated by far right politicians. The town of Mount Shasta is just one example:
Inside the remote California county where the far right took over: ‘Civility went out the window’ In Shasta county the pandemic intensified political divisions, and many officials quit or were pushed out amid bitter tensions.
NYTimes Gift Article: The California County Where MAGA Took Control - Explore this gift article from The New York Times. You can read it for free without a subscription.
I have one question for you Thom. Why in 2015 did you support Hillary over Bernie. He had a fair chance of winning the primary and exit poles in the general showed those who voted for Trump preferred Bernie if he had been on the ballot.
You were friends with Bernie and had brunch with Bernie for ten years. Why did you throw your friend under the bus? We might never have had Trump.
It's true that Precinct Committee Persons elect local and state party officials. However, it is emphatically not true that they determine the party's nominees (here in Arizona at least). I had grown up in New York believing the myth of rising in the party from Precinct Committee Person to Dog Catcher to City Council Person, etc. But when I went to run for local office a few years ago (2020) in Pima County, Arizona, I discovered that (a) anyone who collects sufficient signatures on their nominating petition gets onto the primary ballot, and (b) the party prohibits itself from taking sides in primaries.
As it happened, I was unopposed in the Democratic primary and received limited support from the party in the general election, largely because the seat was thought to be unwinnable due to the district's demographics. Sure enough, I lost.
Therefore, I would revise your advice to say find out your local rules, and if they're similar to Arizona's, go out and find or recruit progressive candidates and work for their campaigns. Or run yourself, if you're qualified.
Thom, you've illuminated a hidden process that few of us even knew existed. But, I fear as some others have pointed out, that we don't have time for that gradual takeover of the local Dem establishment. We need a powerful, focused national movement this coming year that creates a progressive reform platform, develops a reform process that the public would trust, and turns out a massive vote in the 2026 midterms and the 2028 general election. We could kick it off with a Common Sense 2.0 on January 10th next year (the 250th anniversary of Thomas Paine's Common sense). And, we need a Declaration 2.0 on July 4th next year (250th anniversary of the original) to declare our commitment to getting big money out of politics. Between now and then, we need to describe a range of meaningful reforms of our politics and our government that we can build consensus around. Cautious incrementalism won't get us there.
This message needs to be hammered and repeated until it sinks in. How much work would it take to compile a list in every state or district or county with the contact information to call or visit the office or people to become involved? I take it that one would not get this information directly from a senator or representative's website? It seems as if there is a gap and no actual listing in the phone book or on the Internet for the crucial person or office to call. Do they have the number on flyers during elections?
The problem with the Democratic Party is that they are short on maintaining organized energy to get anything done. The saying is that it is like trying to organize cats. Anyone want to comment on that reality?
I suspect it is the reason that Bernie became a solo advocate for years for programs like universal healthcare and other programs for the people, like the rest of the democratic world governments.
It is easy to organize around hysteria about exaggerated or imaginary fears and paranoid delusions about Satan and bad liberals indulging lazy freeloaders and coddling criminals and all that kind of fear-based, religion sponsored nonsense. Finding people willing to do the serious work and to take the time to do research and use science and logic and people with an understanding of history and human behavior is next to impossible in a society of dumbed-down, anti-intellectual, entertainment-oriented consumers and playboys and playgirls. Democracy is not for lamebrains and weak-minded dolts. People who have been trained to follow will follow whoever has the best sounding pitch and the smoothest stories or the demagogues who are willing to target vulnerable victims and minorities as scapegoats. They have entertained us to death.
Amen. Just as 'they' have spent an exorbitant amount of energy and resources to target me as a scapegoated, vulnerable victim. I hate it that I have to be so personal, that I need to defend myself in the face of tyranny. It is absolutely true that Democracy is not for the weak-minded dolts who readily follow those who have the best-sounding pitch that politicians are so good in crafting.
I have a very strong premonition that the Orange Menace will be out of the picture very soon. It may be health issues, the Epstein scandal, or something else but he has outlived his usefulness to the billionaires and the corrupt Republicans. Things could get much worse once he is gone, or the Republicans could disintegrate without their boy leading them around by the nose. Toss a coin. It must happen before the 2026 Mid-term election.
The problem with good ideas is that they float around. What would it take for them to land? It’s not going to be by my efforts, but it could be by yours. Take a position. Call for a coalition. Get sign-ups. It should be a breeze in the climate we are in now. People are searching. Give them something to find.
I wrote about you this week, and about a coalition:
Instead of trying to convert me to become a Democrat, why don't you try to adopt policies that encourage people like me to vote Democratic in the general? I suspect it is because, deep down, you are actually more focused on your own political agenda than trying to save this country from MAGA Republicans.
The trouble with your approach, Thom, is that it both takes too long a time AND, because of that, in the short term, alienates people like me who were once R's and are now independents. Beginning in this next election cycle we need more centrist candidates, not more left-of-center candidates.
Sorry, but to me being a centrist is like sitting in stagnant water that breeds bacteria. Where has it gotten us? Mounting poverty, homelessness, skyrocketing education and healthcare. We need the type of dynamism that Bernie, AOC, and Mamdani wield....
Well put Sophia, I have been hearing this argument for centrism like forever,especially from the never Trumper former Republicans, But they don't answer the question, what policies does centrism favor, how do they stand on economic justice, social equality.
That image of stagnant water really hits the spot. Being a centrist is refusing to pick a side. That doesn't work now, never did.
Yeah, or like a person who cannot make a commitment in a relationship....
It is because of centrist candidates and policies, that we are in the situation that we are in, centrists are ameliorators, concilators, bipartisan, and not fighters. Centrists have given in and given up, and that has enabled MAGA and Trump.
William, you certainly paint a gloomy picture of a future country in which there are only two possibilities, one run by the far right or one by the far left. History shows that, until Trump, that has not been the case, and I think one can make the arguement that Trump won in part because many people like me don't like the extremes of either party. My sense is that it is the centrists like me that either party has to capture, not the other way around.
Tell us then what are your policies, what do you advocate for, what do you favor.
How do you stand on regulating corporations, that they don't exploit and kill their customers?
How do you stand on the issue of Diversity, Equity and Inclusion. On gay rights?On civil rights?On voting rights? on discrimination?
What is it about liberal politics that you find so offputting?
Myself I am non partisan, but I registered Democratic to have a vote in the primary. But my objection to the Democratic party has been it's timidity, the fact that it slops at the same trough as the Republicans, that we could have had Medicare for all (single payor) were it not for Nancy Pelosi, Rahm Emanuel and the lobbying and money of AHIP (Association of Health Insurance Providers)
This seems like an unwinnable argument. What can be a winning way? Develop policy. No sides, just all about forward.
Sue, I think you have put your finger on the answer here. We need to stop talking with labels here and start talking about specific policies, particularly those that also help those "at the edges" of all parties,and who can benefit from them. Thank you!
Psy ops.
What is psy ops Daniel.?
You are deluded. So is MSNBC and most other media.
Biden, via compromise (an by co-opting the extrteme left), was able to get more progressive legislation through Congress than any president since LBJ.
This is the kind of divide and conquer crap I learned from 8th grade Latin -- Julius Ceasar.
Saying I am deluded Daniel is not an answer as to why it is psyops, just another insult.
Biden passed three, watered down, bills, The American Rescue Plan, the Inflation Reduction Act, and the CHIPS and Science Act.
They all passed because there were giant easter eggs in them for the donors.
And also, the Democrats had a window in which they could have solidified, a woman's right to choose, but they chose not to, instead they passed the Respect for Marriage Act (which I applaud, but they could have passed the Respect for Women's Act at the same time.
The reason is obvious, By the time the Respect for Marriage Act was passed, the nation's attitude had shifted on gay marriage, and also it turns out some of the large Republican donors, like Thiel, were gay.
That is not the case with Women's rights, 68% of America identifies as Christians, and Christians are most vehement about women's rights (and patriarchal supremacy)
The platform sets forth party policies, worked out democratically. https://democrats.org/where-we-stand/party-platform/
Those bills are the best we could do. Perfect is the enemy of the feasible. The only was to get "perfect" is fascism.
The idea that the party isn't pure enough comes to us from the 1940s, when the Dixiecrarts split during the convention. They and the Soviets may have hated each other but both worked to split the party.
BTW, I still think we won. Psy ops. Voter intimidation. Did Trump admit that Musk stole Pennsylvania?
Jesus would be rolling over in his grave right now if he hadn't already "risen".
Centrists got us here-move left. Nothing in the middle of the road but yellow lines and dead armadillos (thanks Jim Hightower)
1. In most states, independents can't vote in a primary. Why be independent?
2. I agree we need to be a "big tent" to prevail nationally.
3. All politics is (and are) local. In some parts of the country the national message is toxic for local candidates.
4. These days, (s)he who controls VAT and VAN controls the Democratic party.
5. Based on my experience, Dems need to register and empower more voters. I had to run for my last position -- county Dem executive committee. A candidate who has a built in following can prevail at every level.
There aren't "left of center" Democrats anywhere to be found with the exceptions of Dennis Kucinich, Bernie, AOC, and now Mamdani. Calling Kamala Harris "radical left" is laughable. I wouldn't have voted for her if it hadn't been the Convicted Felon she was running against. Look what the "Centrist" Dems are doing to Mamdani.
Hope you watch C-Span, Judith. There are 98 members of the Progressive Caucus and they want what Bernie and AOC want:
Leadership:
Chair: Greg Casar
Deputy Chair: Ilhan Omar
Whip: Jesús "Chuy" García
Chair Emeritus: Pramila Jayapal
Vice Chairs: Lloyd Doggett, Maxwell Frost, Jared Huffman, Ro Khanna, Morgan McGarvey, Delia Ramirez, Jan Schakowsky, Lateefah Simon, Mark Takano, Rashida Tlaib
Executive Board Members At Large: Chris Deluzio, Veronica Escobar, Summer Lee, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, Bonnie Watson Coleman
Other Notable Members:
Alma Adams, Becca Balint, Suzanne Bonamici, Brendan Boyle, Cori Bush, Jasmine Crockett, Danny Davis, Madeleine Dean, Rosa DeLauro, Dwight Evans, Raúl Grijalva, Hank Johnson, Sydney Kamlager-Dove, Ted Lieu, Jennifer McClellan, Jim McGovern, Grace Meng, Jerrold Nadler, Ayanna Pressley, Linda Sanchez, Jan Schakowsky, Adam Smith, Rashida Tlaib, and Paul Tonko
Actually NOTHING.
Why do we need centrists to get (former) R's disgusted by fascism to vote against fascism? You think that if you sit out, or even vote R in your greater loathing for progressivism, that the fascists will leave you alone?
I’m a left leaning Independent who agrees with almost all the social issues but also understand the economic issues. If one of the parties does not deal with our national debt and deficit, we are not going to be able to pay off either. If we cannot pay our debt, it is possible we will lose our status as the world currency, which would be a disaster for this country. Trump is trying to generate income with his tariffs, that basically tax
the 98% of us while protecting the wealthiest from tax increases. But the Democrats have no plan at all. Create some kind of incentive plan so corporate leaders are motivated to invest in our country. Brainstorm ways to create new jobs as AI takes over hundreds of thousands of white collar jobs. Have contests that offer rewards for out of the box solutions! Make sure that the Democrat Precinct chairmen aren’t former MAGA infiltrating the Democrats. If the Democrats are addressing all of the salient issues instead of relying on social justice issues, they will become an irresistible force. The people want new solutions to all of the problems barreling down the pike at us! If the DNC cannot see that their platform cannot win because it does not address our most pressing problems, then it needs to hire or recruit people who are experts in solving problems! Trying to motivate people to feel sympathy towards others when they are afraid for their own and their children’s financial security is short-sighted, to say the least.
Also, why is no one lambasting the stupidity of the techno-oligarchic Christo-Fascist plan to turn our country into a feudalistic dictatorship with all the wealth held by a handful of billionaires! The middle class is the engine of the economy. Replacing middle class jobs with AI
practically overnight is just stupid. It will gut the middle class. Such a restructuring of our economy should take enough years that there is time for adjustment and the creation of new kinds of employment. What is happening is a power grab by
billionaire sociopaths with no concept of the responsibilities of governance! If the Democrats hire advertising agencies to clearly show how the oligarchic Project 2025 plan will be a disaster for this country, I believe people will wake up and fight for our Democracy!
Andrew M Shaw, You either did not read what I wrote, or you are a far right troll trying to prevent Democrats from reaching out to Independents.
I'm a longtime fan, Thom. As an old SDSer yourself, you may remember me, the only one elected TWICE to the NO, 66-68, then at the Guradian We're pretty much on the same page now, after a long detour in the 70s. You may want to invite me on the show for a dialogue-interview. Carl Davidson, carld717@gmail.com
I have been part of this in my county. It DOES NOT take long at all. I was approached by a progressive friend and asked to attend local meetings of our Dem CCC. I did so and within four months was on the board as secretary. All it takes is:
Be a registered Democrat for 6 months or more
Attend the meetings. In my county there are two per month in two different locations.
Take notes and ASK QUESTIONS of the board members during meetings.
Make yourself known by the above and speaking to individual members after meetings.
Force centrist members to resign their post by attacking them on their positions.
Run for that board position.
It can be a fast takeover done within a few months if you and others are persistent and gain a majority.
This happened in what was considered a somewhat 'conservative' county. It went for Bernie Sandes in the primary and general elections and has voted majority progressive since then.
YOUR INDIVIDUAL ACTIONS COUNT!!! Be part of a better U.S.A.
Thank you for the clear directive Thom, it was exactly the kick-in-the-butt I needed. Now I know exactly what to do....
Sophia, I agree with Thom it is concentrated committed momentum we need. If the nation has the ability to focus and target people why can it not be done? As I was out running with my pup on Saturday I watched has hundreds of people organized to follow me, who knew what I had done in my home that morning, can be achieved working in a concerted effort to infiltrate and turn the Democrat Party progressive like the Concord initiative, might work.
Thom: you used the term slaughter in Gaza. That raises a question not asked, because it is buried in the visuals.
What should Israel have done?What should Israel do? Confronted with a hostile force that is on a religious war and demands nothing but the obliteration of the state of Israel which of course means genocide of the Jews.
hazi Hamad, a leader of Hamas, said in an interview with a Lebanese TV channel that the terror group will repeat the October 7 attack time and again until Israel is annihilated.
“Israel is a country that has no place on our land,” Hamad says in an interview with TV network LBC on October 24, which was published today by MEMRI. “We must remove it because it constitutes a security, military and political catastrophe to the Arab and Islamic nation. We are not ashamed to say this. Will we have to pay a price? Yes, and we are ready to pay it. We are called a nation of martyrs, and we are proud to sacrifice martyrs.”
The Hamas official also repeats the false mantra that Hamas did not intend to harm civilians, but there were “complications” on the ground.
Art 7, HAMAS Covenant and sahih 2925/2926, book 56, hadith 139 al Bukhari
"The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him. Only the Gharkad tree, (evidently a certain kind of tree) would not do that because it is one of the trees of the Jews." (related by al-Bukhari and Moslem).
Faced with that, what then is Israel's proper response?
Anybody?
Of all of the thousands of words printed and spoken about the subject of Gaza and Israel.
This question is not asked,not even in Haaretz.
Not Haaretz, but the facts are muddled. Within Gaza, according to Arab sources, besides the occupation, there are clans fighting among themselves, trying to kill each other off. The PA opposed Hamas and Hamas is retailating against them...
I accept that now that the US hostages have been released, we should not be involved with Netanyahu. Last night we watched an interview with Samer Sinijlawi, a Fatah activist and political reformer, who has become a voice advocating for change in Palestinian society. He is a native of Jerusalem.
Samer joined the Fatah party in Palestine at the early age of 14 during the first Intifada. At the age of 15, he was arrested and had to spend 5 years in jail in Israel. After his prison sentence, Samer was elected as international secretary for the Fatah Youth. He was later elected as a head of International and Israeli relations on the Fatah Supreme Committee.
For over 35 years, Samer has worked tirelessly to build bridges, engage in dialogue, and fight for a future where Israelis and Palestinians recognize each other’s humanity. Samer hopes to end suffering as a political weapon to spread the courage to feel each other’s pain and to find a path to lasting peace for both Israel and Palestine.
Throughout the conversation, Samer explains his efforts to bridge gaps with Israelis, his call for leadership reform, and his bold stance against violence, even while confronting the harsh realities of ongoing conflict. He emphasizes the importance of understanding each side's fears and needs, advocating for mutual respect and a focus on constructive solutions. Samer's message is one of hope, calling for the Palestinians to take responsibility and make the internal changes necessary to secure a peaceful future.
He says they need an election in the West Bank and in Gaza.
He holds Hamas responsible for committing the population to mass suicide.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSNmy2B3lRk
Great post Daniel.
I saw you on Ali Velshi and was glad to see you mention E.Lansing and SDS (when my partner and I had lunch with you we talked about our both being at Michigan State and involved in the anti-Vietnam War protests in different ways at the time). I knew several SDS activists but wasn't a member at the time. I was in Social Work grad school and ended up as the leader of our protests. We were the second department to go on strike (after the Psychology Dept) following the Kent State massacre. Nursing was the third, thus all of Baker Hall had departments close so we put an "on strike" banner on the building. I had the heady experiencing of announcing our demands (along with other student leaders) to an overflow audience in the jam packed auditorium. We never met but were in the very same march to the state capitol building.
By the way, my partner is still in touch with the woman who came from Chicago with her husband to visit you and your team. I expect she is reading this.
As I refect back on those protest days and think about the protests against Trump and his dictatorship I am heartened in some ways and frightened in another.
What inspires me is that the student protests were a major factor (along with the U.S. losing) that led to the country getting out of Vietnam. While at the time we had high hopes we'd make a difference we didn't know that we would. However, LBJ wasn't a dictator. When the National Guard opened fire on students at Kent State the outrage resonated across the country and LBJ cared about this. He responded to public opinion.
Currently we have the closest thing to a dictator in American history. Now we have Trump's Gestapo thugs going after immigrants. The outrage coming from the liberal media and, to varying degrees, the public is like water off a duck's back for Trump, Homan, Bondi, Miller and his Hitlerian psychopaths. Trump not only doesn't care, but as a paradigm of someone in the Dark Tetrad (the Dark Triad plus sadism) he feels good about being able to terrify and hurt his enemies.
While Trump's Gestapo hasn't gunned down anybody, at least not yet, yesterday I went into what I hope was hyperbole mode about the chance Trump would deport his victims to a country where they could be killed. They'd be dropped off in a desert in a host country like South Sudan that Trump would pay big money to, and then it would be out of sight and out of mind as far anyone knew. Their fate would never be known.
There are people like a guy who said his name was Ryan who called in to a CSPAN show who support the shooting of immigrants. Trump has expressed fantasies of alligators in the Rio Grande and shooting people trying to cross in the legs. We have a sadistic president and sadists who support him. Now alligators come up again in his Alligator Alcatraz where his fantasy is them eating people who try to escape.
I agree that Democrats have to get their act together. But I despair that even if they do and take back both houses of Congress and win state and local races we may not even have a "next election" because Trump will have cemented his dictatorship and been able to establish total control. When I think of this happening, I don't think engaging in tradtional politics (and protests) can save us. The only hope I have is that if Trump comes close to pulling this off, declares martial law, and activates the armed forces against citizens, is that the true patriots in the military will effect a coup to depose him.
Here's my Substack related to this: https://halbrown.substack.com/p/who-the-hell-is-ryan-and-why-should
Hal, I am aware that those who protested that war like to pat themselves on the back for ending it, but in reality the protests evoked a reaction, reverse psychology, among middle America and they demanded victory and f...k them damned commie hippies.
What finally did the job Hal, is middle America watching aluminum coffins being unloaded , the daily body count and the 58,000 military funerals of their sons, brothers, uncles and cousins.
Middle America tired of the war Hal that is why it ended.
Middle Russia would tire of that war also, had they freedom of press and freedom of speech, and not the threat of prison or falling out of windows.
I don't see this as "a pat on the back" as if I want to glorify what we did. You are correct that there was pro-war blowback and that it coincided with the Hippie Era (sometime called the counter-culture) didn't help our cause. In fact, however some of us looked like Hippies (Thom with long hair, for example), but we weren't. I don't think so-called Hippies were a major part of the anti-war campus movement, nor were the Yippies ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Youth_International_Party ) for that matter. It wasn't even SDS. It was ordinary middle class students that comprised the majority of the movement.
I don't think the impact of the student protests should be minimized. We did have an impact on the eventual end, but so did everything you say.
The looming threat of the draft was another reason people turned against the war. Those of draft age and their parents didn't wanrt anything to do with a war which had nothing to do with saving democracy in America. The growing death count couldn't be hidden.
Any history of how and the war ended must include what Walter Cronkite said and LBJ's reaction to losing his support. ( https://mediamythalert.com/2009/12/06/cronkite-moment-what-johnson-supposedly-said/ )
It also wasn't the protesting students but also how they impacted their families. Pro-war parents in many cases had to have been educated by their children.
By the way, Michigan State was one of the universities described in "Campus Wars: The Peace Movement At American State Universities in the Vietnam Era " ( https://www.amazon.com/Campus-Wars-Movement-American-Universities/dp/0814735126 )
When we weren't on the streets, the protestors educated the nation one friend or relative at a time. WE were the ones saying that the body count was never going to end because the war was unwinnable. We did the right things---the vets joined US not the HAWKS. Huge impact.
You nailed It, Brother!
Alis,
You are correct. I went from an anti-war protester- many arguments with my father (WWII veteran), but several years passed, and I began to think maybe Johnson was correct- escalate and get out.
In heated discussions with others, I realized that the MIC was in the war for the money, regardless of the body count. I then hit the streets in my Bay Area, San Bruno, CA neighborhood, going door to door to call for an end and bring our troops home. At one point, it was becoming tough because the San Bruno neighborhoods, I came to realize, were defense contractors and employees who got angry with me and said," You are too young to know what you are advocating." But by then, I was convinced we needed to reach out to these individuals and hope to make an impact.
One way or another, I began an activist role in small ways in my neighborhoods.
Excellent and succinct advice for anyone wondering how to make a difference. I’m inspired
This is so important for people to realize. Over the years, I’ve noticed that small town school boards have been infiltrated by far right politicians. The town of Mount Shasta is just one example:
Inside the remote California county where the far right took over: ‘Civility went out the window’ In Shasta county the pandemic intensified political divisions, and many officials quit or were pushed out amid bitter tensions.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/jul/23/california-shasta-county-far-right-extremists-politics-pandemic?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other
The Takeover of Shasta County | The Nation
https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/shasta-county/
NYTimes Gift Article: The California County Where MAGA Took Control - Explore this gift article from The New York Times. You can read it for free without a subscription.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/09/16/us/california-shasta-maga-trump.html?unlocked_article_code=1.aE8.rVZq.4zDwzKcCDhVg&smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare
I have one question for you Thom. Why in 2015 did you support Hillary over Bernie. He had a fair chance of winning the primary and exit poles in the general showed those who voted for Trump preferred Bernie if he had been on the ballot.
You were friends with Bernie and had brunch with Bernie for ten years. Why did you throw your friend under the bus? We might never have had Trump.
It's true that Precinct Committee Persons elect local and state party officials. However, it is emphatically not true that they determine the party's nominees (here in Arizona at least). I had grown up in New York believing the myth of rising in the party from Precinct Committee Person to Dog Catcher to City Council Person, etc. But when I went to run for local office a few years ago (2020) in Pima County, Arizona, I discovered that (a) anyone who collects sufficient signatures on their nominating petition gets onto the primary ballot, and (b) the party prohibits itself from taking sides in primaries.
As it happened, I was unopposed in the Democratic primary and received limited support from the party in the general election, largely because the seat was thought to be unwinnable due to the district's demographics. Sure enough, I lost.
Therefore, I would revise your advice to say find out your local rules, and if they're similar to Arizona's, go out and find or recruit progressive candidates and work for their campaigns. Or run yourself, if you're qualified.
Thom, you've illuminated a hidden process that few of us even knew existed. But, I fear as some others have pointed out, that we don't have time for that gradual takeover of the local Dem establishment. We need a powerful, focused national movement this coming year that creates a progressive reform platform, develops a reform process that the public would trust, and turns out a massive vote in the 2026 midterms and the 2028 general election. We could kick it off with a Common Sense 2.0 on January 10th next year (the 250th anniversary of Thomas Paine's Common sense). And, we need a Declaration 2.0 on July 4th next year (250th anniversary of the original) to declare our commitment to getting big money out of politics. Between now and then, we need to describe a range of meaningful reforms of our politics and our government that we can build consensus around. Cautious incrementalism won't get us there.
Thanks, Thom!
I’ve worked precinct before and it’s tons of fun!
Electioneering
You get a list of ALL the registered voters, go door to door and get their opinions!
You, blue line your supports and make sure they show up on Election Day!
Red line the diehard MAGA cultists!
Return to talk to the undecideds!
Finding and promoting progressive Primary Candidates is Tougher business!
Give coffee clutches!
Show up for other’s coffees!
Hang around the Ward office!
This can be creepy if you’re a chick!
Volunteering is time-consuming and requires some serious dedication!
Pray that the right, progressive candidate shows up at your front door!
Then, work your ass off!
This message needs to be hammered and repeated until it sinks in. How much work would it take to compile a list in every state or district or county with the contact information to call or visit the office or people to become involved? I take it that one would not get this information directly from a senator or representative's website? It seems as if there is a gap and no actual listing in the phone book or on the Internet for the crucial person or office to call. Do they have the number on flyers during elections?
Democratic Party.
The problem with the Democratic Party is that they are short on maintaining organized energy to get anything done. The saying is that it is like trying to organize cats. Anyone want to comment on that reality?
I suspect it is the reason that Bernie became a solo advocate for years for programs like universal healthcare and other programs for the people, like the rest of the democratic world governments.
It is easy to organize around hysteria about exaggerated or imaginary fears and paranoid delusions about Satan and bad liberals indulging lazy freeloaders and coddling criminals and all that kind of fear-based, religion sponsored nonsense. Finding people willing to do the serious work and to take the time to do research and use science and logic and people with an understanding of history and human behavior is next to impossible in a society of dumbed-down, anti-intellectual, entertainment-oriented consumers and playboys and playgirls. Democracy is not for lamebrains and weak-minded dolts. People who have been trained to follow will follow whoever has the best sounding pitch and the smoothest stories or the demagogues who are willing to target vulnerable victims and minorities as scapegoats. They have entertained us to death.
Amen. Just as 'they' have spent an exorbitant amount of energy and resources to target me as a scapegoated, vulnerable victim. I hate it that I have to be so personal, that I need to defend myself in the face of tyranny. It is absolutely true that Democracy is not for the weak-minded dolts who readily follow those who have the best-sounding pitch that politicians are so good in crafting.
I have a very strong premonition that the Orange Menace will be out of the picture very soon. It may be health issues, the Epstein scandal, or something else but he has outlived his usefulness to the billionaires and the corrupt Republicans. Things could get much worse once he is gone, or the Republicans could disintegrate without their boy leading them around by the nose. Toss a coin. It must happen before the 2026 Mid-term election.
Thom - Your belief that we must go all out to stop the Trump/Project 2025 train is quite correct. I posted my recommendations a few days ago on Substack. Here is the link: https://bill740416.substack.com/p/its-time-to-flood-their-zone bill@cdg-corp.com
The problem with good ideas is that they float around. What would it take for them to land? It’s not going to be by my efforts, but it could be by yours. Take a position. Call for a coalition. Get sign-ups. It should be a breeze in the climate we are in now. People are searching. Give them something to find.
I wrote about you this week, and about a coalition:
Something is stirring in the land
Could an upswing be underway?
https://suzannetaylor.substack.com/p/something-is-stirring-in-the-land
Instead of trying to convert me to become a Democrat, why don't you try to adopt policies that encourage people like me to vote Democratic in the general? I suspect it is because, deep down, you are actually more focused on your own political agenda than trying to save this country from MAGA Republicans.
What are those polices Gary Cook. I asked the same of Charlie Sykes at the Bulwark. Crickets.
So what policies, no one can adopt any policies unless they know what they are.