Since the names are widely known in certain circles, and the women who had been abused as girls know the names, a member of theCongress could stand up and read the names out loud without fear of libel attacks, because it would be protected speech and become a part of the official record.
Right on JP. That's my suggestion, posted before I read yours, However Thom is in constant contact with Ro Khanna, who appears weekly as a guest on his show, however I doubt that Ro has the balls to do that, because there are also Democrat names on the list, and reading them aloud on the floor of congress might save him from law suits, but it could endanger his life, his family and or his career.
I think Khanna et al who know the House rules are way ahead of you and are waiting to see how individual Congressional Republicans vote, and a “NO - don’t release the files?” will be on record as Guardians Of Pedophiles (GOP).
BTW Virginia Guiffre was only one of maybe a thousand of victims. She was a kid when she worked at Mar a Lago in the spa. Even if they are not perps, virtually every Mar a Lago member and customer is a potential witness... The Miami Herald and Palm Beach Post have lists of other victims from south Florida.
At the time that Guiffre worked for him, Trump might have been Epstein's acknowledged "best friend" but he was also a competitor. He was in the "model" business. How many of them were minors? Did any of them accompany him to parties? To Epstein's?
This has alrady his hard in the UK. They lost their US ambassador. Their prince is now "No York." After all these years, there is an investigation.
Congress should hear from Maureen Comey, who prosecuted Maxwell. Did she see the Epstein videos and photos? If so, what did she see?
The public should hear from former case prosecutor Marie Villafaña, who had prepared a sex-trafficking indictment against Epstein that was not filed. Should see witness statements, etc. Virginia Guifre was Trumps's employee. Was a minor. Was Trump interviewed?
Some of the girls were from eastern Europe, and after they became expendible returned there. Does the State Department have records? Visas?
The newest development is the Wolfe defamation case against Melania Trump. I hope he gets to depose Trump.
I am sure that Ro who knows the rules, also knows that Adelita will not be seated, that or events will transpire that make revelation irrelevant.
It needs to be done now, not at some distant date in the future, the longer he waits the more entrenched the regime becomes and the harder it is to depose the King.
Just an excuse Daniel. I know that the rules permit each member of congress to address the chamber, whether it is is occupied or not, and everything they say goes into the record.
We see it all of the time son CSPAN, Congress critters standing on the loor in front of an empty chamber, making speeches.
You should know better than making obfuscatory statements in he days of AI generative:
Debates in the House are more structured and time-limited than in the Senate. Several formats exist for a member to give a speech:
One-minute speeches: Delivered at the beginning of a legislative day or after legislative business concludes, these speeches are for a member to speak on any topic. They require unanimous consent from the House and are granted at the Speaker's discretion.
Morning hour debate: A period is set aside for members to speak for up to five minutes on any topic of their choice.
Special-order speeches: Following legislative business, members can reserve longer speaking slots, with priority given to those designated by party leadership.
Legislative debate: When a bill is being considered, debate is typically limited, and the time is divided between the majority and minority parties.
Senate rules
The Senate's rules provide for more open and extensive debate than the House, most famously permitting the filibuster.
Unlimited debate: The tradition of unlimited debate means that senators may speak for as long as they hold the floor.
Two-speech limit: A senator may not speak more than twice on the same question on the same legislative day, unless the Senate grants permission without debate.
Ending a filibuster: A filibuster can be ended by invoking cloture, a procedure that requires a supermajority of 60 senators and limits further debate to a maximum of 30 additional hours.
Decorum and debate rules for both chambers
To maintain order, both the House and Senate have strict rules of decorum that members must follow during a speech or debate:
Members must always address their remarks to the Presiding Officer (the Speaker in the House or President in the Senate).
Remarks must be confined to the question under debate and avoid personal attacks on other members, the President, or references to people in the galleries.
A member cannot interrupt another senator in debate without their consent.
Constitutional protection
The "Speech or Debate Clause" in the Constitution (Article I, Section 6, Clause 1) explicitly protects members of Congress from being questioned in any other place for their official legislative actions, including speeches given on the floor. This clause protects members from criminal and civil liability for their remarks made as part of the legislative process.
Exactly Sir, he is a psychopath, who is also using the treasury as his piggy bank and the White House as his country club. The membership to the club is restricted to people that have sold their souls to him and the devil.
It's time for the Guardians of Pedophiles to go on the record. The Democrats are standing with the victims---the Republicans have chosen the psychopaths.
TRump allegedly trafficked the models and pageant girls in his own operation. Melania knows and Wolf is calling her bluff. Donald will free Maxwell. There are a lot of living witnesses too ashamed and too scared to come forward.
It's all so sick - and embarrassing. The sick part should be self-evident to everyone, but the embarrassment lies in our seeming inability to agree as a people that a gang of disgusting predators - that no one on this planet would allow near their children - should be outed and jailed.
Tr*mp’s bevy of decorative-cross-wearing Ivanka wannabes, Mitch McConnell-wannabe Mike Johnson’s endless lies and delays, etc., etc., speak volumes about Repugnican “Christianity” and regard for the rule of law. The decades of continuing abuse of those children by the high and mighty reveals a level of depravity that should enrage decent citizens everywhere and ensure commensurate severe punishment. So far, the message to these and similar victims is “get over it”.
Here is what can be done. If anyone discloses the names of these people in public, they can and will be sued. However thanks to the speech and debate clause their names can be read aloud on the floor or congress without any consequences.
So I suggest that Ro Khanna, contact Amy Wallace and get the names of these people and read them aloud, that will end our national nightmare, but it will also end the careers of many a Democrat because we all know that the sex drive and desire for young girls is not limited to party lines.
See my comments above. Move the pawns before attacking the queens.
I know you call him a liar (not to mention me) but Eric Swalwell (D-CA) tweeted about an "Epstein bomb" about to drop; over 100 Republican members might "jailbreak" from Trump.
Frankly I don't believe that even three Republicans other than those that already have, are going to break from Trump.
He has them by the balls. As Nixon said, grab them by the balls and their hearts and minds will follow.
The longer we hang on, hoping that "the bomb will drop" and someone or something comes to our rescue, the more entrenched this fascist regime becomes.
Now he has demonstrated that he will never leave the White House, by destroying the East Wing, the hint came when he gilded the Offal Office, then planted two flag poles, why the fuck non one gets the message is beyond me, perhaps they are afraid of staring the monster in the face, and like a child pulls the covers over their head.
Really Daniel, rooting for the wrong team? Unlike you I don't live in la la land.
It is quite apparent that Trump has modified the White House to suit his psychological needs, because he doesn't intend to leave.
Do you believe the contrary.
Why would he make such massive changes to the Oval Office, the grounds and the White House if was going to leave in 3 1/2 years, or do you believe that he is doing it to leave a legacy and that miraculously he will exit in 2029?
You really do live in a world of your own creation. The institutions on which you rely are kaput.
I take your comments and accusation as "That Hitler fellow really can't do all that he says"
The only hope YOU have are the Democrartic Party and what we can do with the current Congress. But in your pup tent mentality you'ved assumed the circular firing squad position and shoot yourself in the ass.
Again, I am waiting for the Democratic party leaders to actually do something and show some spine, not just the Mamdani's, AOC's and Sanders, which the DNC would like to disappear off the face of the earth.
What we have instead is a bunch of lack luster, cautious, fearful, self preservationists.
All it takes is Ro, Eric or any Democrat to stand up and read the list of perverted perps in Congress.
And what do have? Crickets.
You even suggested that it should be a Republican Massie, and that we should wait forever until a Discharge petion is signed. great ploy, for moral cowards.
It takes guts for someone to read the list, even on the senate floor, because who ever does it will incur the wrath of MAGAts, maybe even death threats.
But hey leave it congress, spread the problem, around.
And all the discharge petition will do is force a a bill to the floor that will then have to be voted on. and all the bill will do is force Pam Bondi to provide the complete (redacted, files to a congressional committee chaired by a Republican., and of course it will be classified by congress.
It is a fucking shell game Daniel, and you being a retired judge, should know that.
Who is working on the wrong side Daniel, you who hold out false and vain hope, chasing snipes and will o the wisps, or me who demands real direct action?
Just now I am listening to the FBI press conference about breaking an illegal gambling scheme involving poker and the NBA Basketball league! This is peanuts compared to the Epstein scandal!!!
Well, Prince Andrew just gave up the title of Duke of York and allegedly he was linked to Epstein. The Royal Family seems to be trying to distance itself from the coming damage. Too bad America's "nobility" can't see the handwriting on the wall. Scandals like this eventually come out, and as Nixon learned, Americans hate coverups.
We never got justice for his treason in interference with the peace agreement that LBJ had worked out in 1968. Over 25,000 Americans died in the war after the failed attempt at a peace agreement in 1968.
Yep. Meanwhile, Krasnov is busy destroying Dem legacy the Repubs were always mad about. The rose garden. They hated that the Camelot of Dems were always in the newspapers while their hate was ignored. The first damn thing that needs to be done as soon as possible is restore the rose garden and get rid of those damn Republican stone pavements. And here they go again taking away EBT in Nov and Dec just in time for Thanksgiving and Christmas. The cruelty is the point and they are hoping this time food riots to call in the military. The hate of these people knows no end. I hope the states step up and end this madness.
Trump could make this all happen. This is all on him. We have pretty much exhausted the thesaurus trying to find words that many of us use to try to document his sadistic malignant narcissism that haven't been used countless times. Many things he has done make excesses like his ripping down part of the historic White House look like a minor egotistic indulgence. Still, I decided to write about that today in "Trump needs a ginormous gilded ballroom fit for a king. Who are we mere mortals to deny him such a royal presidential perk?" https://halbrown.substack.com/p/trump-needs-a-ginormous-gilded-ballroom
In defense (sort of) of Catholic bishops, we have lifelong celibate old men having to decide what to do about a priest fondling an altar boy. Fathers A, B, and C have all expressed remorse for their sin, and have begun some sort of atonement. Their bishop has never been a victim of sexual abuse himself, so in his mind, it is just a sin like masturbation. He asks himself if forgiving their sins and continuing business as usual is not what Jesus would have done - forgive the sinner. Moreover, if this behavior were to become public, it might cause people to leave the church, putting countless souls at risk of sin.
To most people, that is a selfish and brutal rationalization. Yet Pope after Pope refuses to see that their Church's arbitrary celibacy requirement for priests is likely the root cause of such behavior.
Past conversations with psychology colleagues seem to agree that skipping adolescent puberty in favor of preparing teenagers for a celibate life as a catholic cleric (maybe) probably stunts their sexual maturity to the "I'll show you mine, if you show me yours" stage. That likely leads to "May I touch that?" and eventual sexual abuse of pubescent male altarboys beginning to explore their own sexuality. This is somewhat validated by research showing that the majority of defrocked priests subsequently enter heterosexual marriages.
So far, all Rome has done is to shutter nearly all prep school seminaries globally to ensure seminarians are well past puberty. But Rome still needs to review its policy on clerical celibacy. It was initiated mainly to fight the nepotism of married bishops who were passing ownership of their diocese to their sons. This was costing the Vatican its wealth. Celibacy was rationalized to the seminarians, priests, and laity as removing the distraction of a family to focus on the spiritual needs of parishioners. However, Protestant Christians are free to marry, and there is scant evidence that their pastoral activities are limited by being married.
From what I have observed in life, enlightened by the horrendous experience of being sexually abused, which includes pedophiles, is that a priest who is not a pedophile will not abuse. Still, a priest who is a pedophile most likely will. A pedophile who enters the seminary knows he is a pedophile. I don’t pretend to understand their motives for becoming a priest, but I believe, as across all fields of endeavor, a pedophile lurks.
I have followed the crimes of sexual abuse in the Catholic church. Unwittingly, like the bishop in your example, who explains away the sin and the possibility of atonement, a priest who asks for forgiveness instructs us to do what Jesus would have done: forgive the sinner. But there is also the fact that over and over, the church has been educated to understand that the sickness of pedophilia never goes away and is a crime of untold consequences; therefore, there is no bishop on earth who makes such a claim who can be absolved.
I did not know that the fight against the nepotism of married bishops who were passing ownership of their diocese to their own sons led the Roman Catholic Church to justify the rationalization of celibacy. Very interestingly, it was costing the Vatican its wealth! Much like the cases of pedophiles in modern times.
And today's news. Archbishop of U.S. Anglican Church Is Accused of Sexual Harassment. Another leader in the breakaway denomination has been accused of responding slowly to accusations of abuse and grooming against a lay leader. NYT
"The highest-ranking prelate of the Anglican Church in North America, a conservative denomination that broke from the Episcopal Church in 2009, has been formally accused of sexual harassment, plagiarism and bullying by former employees.
"The accusations against Archbishop Stephen Wood, 62, came amid continuing turmoil in the small denomination, including the ecclesiastical trial of a bishop and other accusations of mishandling abuse."
Here an interesting dichotomy is introduced, not new to the catholic church, BTW; catholic priests should not be seen as accountable to laws that clearly are established to protect children from pedophiles because priests who are pedophiles should be granted exemtion because they "repent for their sins . . . " A very presumtuous kind of an elitist suggestion that since such vile acts were committed within the sanctified walls of their church, they have their own perspective of culpability. Instead of protecting children, it is the preists that should be protected because they have atoned with ritual. Sins to the hierarchy of the church should override the common laws of transgression that the rest of us are to be held justly accountable. I hold that is exactly how the Catholic church HAS acted. You know, special.
The part that is hard to grasp, given how outrageous pedophilia is, is that the "pedo" clergy are not usually pedophiles per se. Because their sexual development is stuck at age 12 or 13, they are more at an exploratory stage sexually, as are their victims. The altar boys were frequent targets because the priests see these young boys daily at services. Their sexual encounters are usually brief with one or two same-sex victims,
As I noted, most defrocked priests eventually marry adult women. True pedophiles pretty much prefer sex with children of the opposite gender their entire lives - usually teenage girls, you know, like Epstein and his wealthy celebrity associates. Very few true pedophiles are lifelong homosexuals.
Thanks for the interesting historical perspective on why celibacy was introduced. If one were to distill that a bit, it appears the organization’s desire for wealth accumulation/preservation and control were the root causes or reasons for the policy.
The pursuit of material gain is the “red thread” that runs through this and the similar issues in other religions. Mega church anyone?
The Dalai Lama stands out as a different example with his stance and personal practice that physical possessions cannot subdue mental suffering. I saw his compassion demonstrated when the 88-year-old Dalai Lama stopped his teaching because he noticed that the monks had missed serving tea to a group of probably 40 participants in a group of a couple thousand at Dharamshala. It was a memorable two minutes in a very memorable two-day period.
Thanks, Thom, for highlighting oligarchic hubris that goes to the extent of using people like bathroom tissue. Laws, as they see it, are a floor for them to walk on, and a ceiling for the rest of us to live under.
Since the names are widely known in certain circles, and the women who had been abused as girls know the names, a member of theCongress could stand up and read the names out loud without fear of libel attacks, because it would be protected speech and become a part of the official record.
Right on JP. That's my suggestion, posted before I read yours, However Thom is in constant contact with Ro Khanna, who appears weekly as a guest on his show, however I doubt that Ro has the balls to do that, because there are also Democrat names on the list, and reading them aloud on the floor of congress might save him from law suits, but it could endanger his life, his family and or his career.
I think Khanna et al who know the House rules are way ahead of you and are waiting to see how individual Congressional Republicans vote, and a “NO - don’t release the files?” will be on record as Guardians Of Pedophiles (GOP).
BTW Virginia Guiffre was only one of maybe a thousand of victims. She was a kid when she worked at Mar a Lago in the spa. Even if they are not perps, virtually every Mar a Lago member and customer is a potential witness... The Miami Herald and Palm Beach Post have lists of other victims from south Florida.
At the time that Guiffre worked for him, Trump might have been Epstein's acknowledged "best friend" but he was also a competitor. He was in the "model" business. How many of them were minors? Did any of them accompany him to parties? To Epstein's?
This has alrady his hard in the UK. They lost their US ambassador. Their prince is now "No York." After all these years, there is an investigation.
Congress should hear from Maureen Comey, who prosecuted Maxwell. Did she see the Epstein videos and photos? If so, what did she see?
The public should hear from former case prosecutor Marie Villafaña, who had prepared a sex-trafficking indictment against Epstein that was not filed. Should see witness statements, etc. Virginia Guifre was Trumps's employee. Was a minor. Was Trump interviewed?
Some of the girls were from eastern Europe, and after they became expendible returned there. Does the State Department have records? Visas?
The newest development is the Wolfe defamation case against Melania Trump. I hope he gets to depose Trump.
I am sure that Ro who knows the rules, also knows that Adelita will not be seated, that or events will transpire that make revelation irrelevant.
It needs to be done now, not at some distant date in the future, the longer he waits the more entrenched the regime becomes and the harder it is to depose the King.
He knows the rules. You don't.
Just an excuse Daniel. I know that the rules permit each member of congress to address the chamber, whether it is is occupied or not, and everything they say goes into the record.
We see it all of the time son CSPAN, Congress critters standing on the loor in front of an empty chamber, making speeches.
You should know better than making obfuscatory statements in he days of AI generative:
Debates in the House are more structured and time-limited than in the Senate. Several formats exist for a member to give a speech:
One-minute speeches: Delivered at the beginning of a legislative day or after legislative business concludes, these speeches are for a member to speak on any topic. They require unanimous consent from the House and are granted at the Speaker's discretion.
Morning hour debate: A period is set aside for members to speak for up to five minutes on any topic of their choice.
Special-order speeches: Following legislative business, members can reserve longer speaking slots, with priority given to those designated by party leadership.
Legislative debate: When a bill is being considered, debate is typically limited, and the time is divided between the majority and minority parties.
Senate rules
The Senate's rules provide for more open and extensive debate than the House, most famously permitting the filibuster.
Unlimited debate: The tradition of unlimited debate means that senators may speak for as long as they hold the floor.
Two-speech limit: A senator may not speak more than twice on the same question on the same legislative day, unless the Senate grants permission without debate.
Ending a filibuster: A filibuster can be ended by invoking cloture, a procedure that requires a supermajority of 60 senators and limits further debate to a maximum of 30 additional hours.
Decorum and debate rules for both chambers
To maintain order, both the House and Senate have strict rules of decorum that members must follow during a speech or debate:
Members must always address their remarks to the Presiding Officer (the Speaker in the House or President in the Senate).
Remarks must be confined to the question under debate and avoid personal attacks on other members, the President, or references to people in the galleries.
A member cannot interrupt another senator in debate without their consent.
Constitutional protection
The "Speech or Debate Clause" in the Constitution (Article I, Section 6, Clause 1) explicitly protects members of Congress from being questioned in any other place for their official legislative actions, including speeches given on the floor. This clause protects members from criminal and civil liability for their remarks made as part of the legislative process.
Need to protect their sources from liability. May lead to relevant inquiry, give them subpoena power.
Awesome, Mr. Hartmann.
Donald is not only demented, he uses "other" people's children for:
a. Semen receptacles
b. [soon] Cannon fodder
He's perverse. And, diabolical.
Exactly Sir, he is a psychopath, who is also using the treasury as his piggy bank and the White House as his country club. The membership to the club is restricted to people that have sold their souls to him and the devil.
It's time for the Guardians of Pedophiles to go on the record. The Democrats are standing with the victims---the Republicans have chosen the psychopaths.
TRump allegedly trafficked the models and pageant girls in his own operation. Melania knows and Wolf is calling her bluff. Donald will free Maxwell. There are a lot of living witnesses too ashamed and too scared to come forward.
It's all so sick - and embarrassing. The sick part should be self-evident to everyone, but the embarrassment lies in our seeming inability to agree as a people that a gang of disgusting predators - that no one on this planet would allow near their children - should be outed and jailed.
Both.
Is anyone looking at the suicides of Epstein and Virginia Giuffre? Were they suicides, or...?
Tr*mp’s bevy of decorative-cross-wearing Ivanka wannabes, Mitch McConnell-wannabe Mike Johnson’s endless lies and delays, etc., etc., speak volumes about Repugnican “Christianity” and regard for the rule of law. The decades of continuing abuse of those children by the high and mighty reveals a level of depravity that should enrage decent citizens everywhere and ensure commensurate severe punishment. So far, the message to these and similar victims is “get over it”.
Here is what can be done. If anyone discloses the names of these people in public, they can and will be sued. However thanks to the speech and debate clause their names can be read aloud on the floor or congress without any consequences.
So I suggest that Ro Khanna, contact Amy Wallace and get the names of these people and read them aloud, that will end our national nightmare, but it will also end the careers of many a Democrat because we all know that the sex drive and desire for young girls is not limited to party lines.
See my comments above. Move the pawns before attacking the queens.
I know you call him a liar (not to mention me) but Eric Swalwell (D-CA) tweeted about an "Epstein bomb" about to drop; over 100 Republican members might "jailbreak" from Trump.
Massive Congressional visits November 18.
https://www.instagram.com/flare.usa/p/DP_mdOyjdiG/
Visit Congressional Republicans.https://www.mobilize.us/indivisible/event/851451/
The bomb is about to drop, why hasn't it dropped.
Frankly I don't believe that even three Republicans other than those that already have, are going to break from Trump.
He has them by the balls. As Nixon said, grab them by the balls and their hearts and minds will follow.
The longer we hang on, hoping that "the bomb will drop" and someone or something comes to our rescue, the more entrenched this fascist regime becomes.
Now he has demonstrated that he will never leave the White House, by destroying the East Wing, the hint came when he gilded the Offal Office, then planted two flag poles, why the fuck non one gets the message is beyond me, perhaps they are afraid of staring the monster in the face, and like a child pulls the covers over their head.
Keep on rooting for the WRONG team.
Really Daniel, rooting for the wrong team? Unlike you I don't live in la la land.
It is quite apparent that Trump has modified the White House to suit his psychological needs, because he doesn't intend to leave.
Do you believe the contrary.
Why would he make such massive changes to the Oval Office, the grounds and the White House if was going to leave in 3 1/2 years, or do you believe that he is doing it to leave a legacy and that miraculously he will exit in 2029?
You really do live in a world of your own creation. The institutions on which you rely are kaput.
I take your comments and accusation as "That Hitler fellow really can't do all that he says"
The only hope YOU have are the Democrartic Party and what we can do with the current Congress. But in your pup tent mentality you'ved assumed the circular firing squad position and shoot yourself in the ass.
Again, I am waiting for the Democratic party leaders to actually do something and show some spine, not just the Mamdani's, AOC's and Sanders, which the DNC would like to disappear off the face of the earth.
What we have instead is a bunch of lack luster, cautious, fearful, self preservationists.
All it takes is Ro, Eric or any Democrat to stand up and read the list of perverted perps in Congress.
And what do have? Crickets.
You even suggested that it should be a Republican Massie, and that we should wait forever until a Discharge petion is signed. great ploy, for moral cowards.
It takes guts for someone to read the list, even on the senate floor, because who ever does it will incur the wrath of MAGAts, maybe even death threats.
But hey leave it congress, spread the problem, around.
And all the discharge petition will do is force a a bill to the floor that will then have to be voted on. and all the bill will do is force Pam Bondi to provide the complete (redacted, files to a congressional committee chaired by a Republican., and of course it will be classified by congress.
It is a fucking shell game Daniel, and you being a retired judge, should know that.
Who is working on the wrong side Daniel, you who hold out false and vain hope, chasing snipes and will o the wisps, or me who demands real direct action?
Just now I am listening to the FBI press conference about breaking an illegal gambling scheme involving poker and the NBA Basketball league! This is peanuts compared to the Epstein scandal!!!
The NBA fraud case investigation started in Biden administration.
Well, Prince Andrew just gave up the title of Duke of York and allegedly he was linked to Epstein. The Royal Family seems to be trying to distance itself from the coming damage. Too bad America's "nobility" can't see the handwriting on the wall. Scandals like this eventually come out, and as Nixon learned, Americans hate coverups.
We never got justice for his treason in interference with the peace agreement that LBJ had worked out in 1968. Over 25,000 Americans died in the war after the failed attempt at a peace agreement in 1968.
Yep. Meanwhile, Krasnov is busy destroying Dem legacy the Repubs were always mad about. The rose garden. They hated that the Camelot of Dems were always in the newspapers while their hate was ignored. The first damn thing that needs to be done as soon as possible is restore the rose garden and get rid of those damn Republican stone pavements. And here they go again taking away EBT in Nov and Dec just in time for Thanksgiving and Christmas. The cruelty is the point and they are hoping this time food riots to call in the military. The hate of these people knows no end. I hope the states step up and end this madness.
Not to mention the Constitiution.
Who has ever been "accountable" except the people at the lower end of life?
Ans. Those who are audited.
Yeah, Al Capone...
Trump could make this all happen. This is all on him. We have pretty much exhausted the thesaurus trying to find words that many of us use to try to document his sadistic malignant narcissism that haven't been used countless times. Many things he has done make excesses like his ripping down part of the historic White House look like a minor egotistic indulgence. Still, I decided to write about that today in "Trump needs a ginormous gilded ballroom fit for a king. Who are we mere mortals to deny him such a royal presidential perk?" https://halbrown.substack.com/p/trump-needs-a-ginormous-gilded-ballroom
Republicans obey the commandment of their true cult leader Reagan,
"Though shalt not speak ill of a fellow Republican."
It matters not to them - who else is in the file.
Goons Obliterating Progress
In defense (sort of) of Catholic bishops, we have lifelong celibate old men having to decide what to do about a priest fondling an altar boy. Fathers A, B, and C have all expressed remorse for their sin, and have begun some sort of atonement. Their bishop has never been a victim of sexual abuse himself, so in his mind, it is just a sin like masturbation. He asks himself if forgiving their sins and continuing business as usual is not what Jesus would have done - forgive the sinner. Moreover, if this behavior were to become public, it might cause people to leave the church, putting countless souls at risk of sin.
To most people, that is a selfish and brutal rationalization. Yet Pope after Pope refuses to see that their Church's arbitrary celibacy requirement for priests is likely the root cause of such behavior.
Past conversations with psychology colleagues seem to agree that skipping adolescent puberty in favor of preparing teenagers for a celibate life as a catholic cleric (maybe) probably stunts their sexual maturity to the "I'll show you mine, if you show me yours" stage. That likely leads to "May I touch that?" and eventual sexual abuse of pubescent male altarboys beginning to explore their own sexuality. This is somewhat validated by research showing that the majority of defrocked priests subsequently enter heterosexual marriages.
So far, all Rome has done is to shutter nearly all prep school seminaries globally to ensure seminarians are well past puberty. But Rome still needs to review its policy on clerical celibacy. It was initiated mainly to fight the nepotism of married bishops who were passing ownership of their diocese to their sons. This was costing the Vatican its wealth. Celibacy was rationalized to the seminarians, priests, and laity as removing the distraction of a family to focus on the spiritual needs of parishioners. However, Protestant Christians are free to marry, and there is scant evidence that their pastoral activities are limited by being married.
Tomonthebeach,
From what I have observed in life, enlightened by the horrendous experience of being sexually abused, which includes pedophiles, is that a priest who is not a pedophile will not abuse. Still, a priest who is a pedophile most likely will. A pedophile who enters the seminary knows he is a pedophile. I don’t pretend to understand their motives for becoming a priest, but I believe, as across all fields of endeavor, a pedophile lurks.
I have followed the crimes of sexual abuse in the Catholic church. Unwittingly, like the bishop in your example, who explains away the sin and the possibility of atonement, a priest who asks for forgiveness instructs us to do what Jesus would have done: forgive the sinner. But there is also the fact that over and over, the church has been educated to understand that the sickness of pedophilia never goes away and is a crime of untold consequences; therefore, there is no bishop on earth who makes such a claim who can be absolved.
I did not know that the fight against the nepotism of married bishops who were passing ownership of their diocese to their own sons led the Roman Catholic Church to justify the rationalization of celibacy. Very interestingly, it was costing the Vatican its wealth! Much like the cases of pedophiles in modern times.
And today's news. Archbishop of U.S. Anglican Church Is Accused of Sexual Harassment. Another leader in the breakaway denomination has been accused of responding slowly to accusations of abuse and grooming against a lay leader. NYT
"The highest-ranking prelate of the Anglican Church in North America, a conservative denomination that broke from the Episcopal Church in 2009, has been formally accused of sexual harassment, plagiarism and bullying by former employees.
"The accusations against Archbishop Stephen Wood, 62, came amid continuing turmoil in the small denomination, including the ecclesiastical trial of a bishop and other accusations of mishandling abuse."
Here an interesting dichotomy is introduced, not new to the catholic church, BTW; catholic priests should not be seen as accountable to laws that clearly are established to protect children from pedophiles because priests who are pedophiles should be granted exemtion because they "repent for their sins . . . " A very presumtuous kind of an elitist suggestion that since such vile acts were committed within the sanctified walls of their church, they have their own perspective of culpability. Instead of protecting children, it is the preists that should be protected because they have atoned with ritual. Sins to the hierarchy of the church should override the common laws of transgression that the rest of us are to be held justly accountable. I hold that is exactly how the Catholic church HAS acted. You know, special.
The part that is hard to grasp, given how outrageous pedophilia is, is that the "pedo" clergy are not usually pedophiles per se. Because their sexual development is stuck at age 12 or 13, they are more at an exploratory stage sexually, as are their victims. The altar boys were frequent targets because the priests see these young boys daily at services. Their sexual encounters are usually brief with one or two same-sex victims,
As I noted, most defrocked priests eventually marry adult women. True pedophiles pretty much prefer sex with children of the opposite gender their entire lives - usually teenage girls, you know, like Epstein and his wealthy celebrity associates. Very few true pedophiles are lifelong homosexuals.
Thanks for the interesting historical perspective on why celibacy was introduced. If one were to distill that a bit, it appears the organization’s desire for wealth accumulation/preservation and control were the root causes or reasons for the policy.
The pursuit of material gain is the “red thread” that runs through this and the similar issues in other religions. Mega church anyone?
The Dalai Lama stands out as a different example with his stance and personal practice that physical possessions cannot subdue mental suffering. I saw his compassion demonstrated when the 88-year-old Dalai Lama stopped his teaching because he noticed that the monks had missed serving tea to a group of probably 40 participants in a group of a couple thousand at Dharamshala. It was a memorable two minutes in a very memorable two-day period.
If so many have The List, why has it not been leaked?
Thanks, Thom, for highlighting oligarchic hubris that goes to the extent of using people like bathroom tissue. Laws, as they see it, are a floor for them to walk on, and a ceiling for the rest of us to live under.
Money will always be the fuel that drives the engine of entitlement.
Who will prosecute when the names are released?
We're hoping the Jerry Weiss scenario will kick in....