I've said for years: "Trump supporters don't care if he lies TO them as long as he keeps lying FOR them." They love him for his ability to get away with it. What we find most appalling about him—the deceit, the arrogance, the hate and racism, the corruption and hypocrisy—are precisely what they find most appealing. But what's really frightening is their shared addiction to revenge, as this article explains: https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2020/12/12/trump-grievance-addiction-444570
What is more frightening to me is that most of his supporters do not even understand that he is harming them. To be that unworldly and unaware is just dangerous in this world. The fact that as long as Trump and his ilk, which he has bred in the Republican party by going over the line again and again and again until the norms are some twisted version of reality, and evilness is goodness. That we are unreliable internationally because whatever Biden does, people know that he can be replaced by Trump and only isolated people and the young would not know how dangerous he is globally. Despots love it because he destabilizes the USA, and invites them in to our secrets and destroys our security. It is hard enough to be secure in this day and age of endless internet exposure. I recently found this out the hard way as a parent, and am still reeling from it. Evil = Good in the Republican Party that has been made in Trumps image. A twisted villain of a person who can create goodness out of evil by telling compelling stories that feed the egos of his followers just as Putin does. The great former empire that they both want to restore is the world in a time before dental care, and modern surgery. Let them live in those good old days on their own.
Excellent commentary Thom. Dead center bulls -eye hits on the malignancy that is tRump and his con job on Americans. It’s all about the grift, Republican grifters all surrounding the tRump orbit cloaked in delusional Americanisms and fake patriotic BS. Yup, the “gullibles” really bought the cool aid fix, even dying for it by believing the BS during the worst pandemic of our lifetime. I’m in indictment heaven waiting for the tRump trials and the imploding of the Republican Party. I don’t believe the MSM hysteria that tRump will magically win 2024. He’s toast! Thank goodness for our legal system and the sheer professionalism of Jack Smith. Get the popcorn ready!
Ah yes the fake patriotism. These treasonous bastards, disprespect the flag, that they claim to love.
I was driving along a road, when I saw a house with a flag pole and a worn, dirty, barely readable flag. I see quite a few (a rural community), and all the flags are on poles and are tattered and.or dirty. Total disrespect for the flag, As is wearing as a bikini, a swim suit a wigdana,
Title 8 USC forbids these kinds of displays. The MFers use the flag as a crutch, just as they use the USA,USA chant.
LOL. As an atheist who, under family pressure (my uncle in whose house I lived, was a southern B aptist preacher, required me to attend church on Sunday and Wednesday, then years later I married a Catholic, and of course had to go through, that process, and attend Catholic church.
I found that both scams had a thing in common, besides using their god as a sock puppet, and that is forgiveness, to serve them from hellfire and damnation.
Seven years if cognitive dissonance, proclaiming to be a Catholic, was too much, back to who I really was, a skeptic and an atheist.
With the Catholics, you can kill someone, go to confession, say a few hail Mary's and Our fathers as an act of contrition, and good to go, do it again, until the next time you go to confession.
With the Baptists, you just stand up, walk to the pulpit, and declare you are a sinner, without specifying the sin, and the put hands on you, and voila born again, and again, and again and again.
The rational Trump supporters won't admit they were wrong, and the irrational ones need to be reprogrammed for the I'm the cult. I'm doubtful anything objective gets through to them. My Republican friends have gone very quiet on the subject of Trump.
Excellent work as usual, but I keep thinking about a dinner that I just had with a good friend. She is well educated and very open minded about many things (and incidentally has several gay siblings whom she loves dearly). But about Trump, "He wasn't responsible for January 6th," "He's working for those who don't have much," "He's fighting the woke radicals," and so on and so on. Facts don't matter, it is perception. Try convincing a person taken in by a Ponzi scheme, a cult (which incidentally the Republicans are), a well organized gang, or any other group that offers stability, the sense of empowerment, and an answer to life, preferably with a leader who offers certainty. People can be, and are, deprogrammed all the time. But sheer facts rarely do it.
Not just change the channel, but stop funding him. I agree with Kathy that it's all about the grift, keeping the grift going. Probably why Trump has his lawyer trying to assuage his base a little longer, in an attempt to keep the funds coming for as long as possible.
Fraud almost always involves speech: it’s hard to defraud somebody out of something without talking to or at them. But that doesn’t even remotely make it protected by the First Amendment’s free speech provision. Our prisons are filled with people who defrauded others purely with their words.
I love this comment, Thom! I was sickened watching dt's lawyer being interviewed Sunday by Chuck Todd and George Stephanopoulos repeatedly and smugly commenting that this was all a free speech issue and blaming the Biden Admin for charges being brought against Trump.
Your comment about our prisons being filled with people who defrauded others needs to hammered in with TV/cable adds. I also wish you could go on national TV and present your whole article as a Public Service Announcement!
Why couldn't George or Chuck respond to dt's lawyer, "the Biden admin had nothing to do with these charges" or, "the line on free speech is crossed when a person is using it to defraud others".
I guess I'll just have to have faith that our justice systems proves that at dt's trial.
China has about a thousand billionaires 1/3 more than America. The cultist believe the Chinese are communist despite the facts that China is a capitalist dictatorship like Russia and Saudi Arabia and almost all the failed third world Nations. The cultist also believe Trump won the election despite the facts. In order to deprogram the cultists, we must present them with the facts over and over and over again and point out what their future will be like living under a capitalist dictatorship. Where they have no rights or freedom. Where they can be turned into slaves, starved, tortured, no social spending, their organs harvested, their children used as sex slaves, where they drink poisoned polluted water and food and drugs. We must not forget chopped up in a bathroom also. The only way we can possibly reach them, is through buying up commercials and donating money to fund the commercials. The commercials could be on the cheap antenna TV channels, the Western channels the country music channels the NASCAR channels the rodeo channels. The truth is cheaper to spread than lies. For probably 1/10 of money we could undo whatbthe billionaires have spent over a trillion trying to successfully brainwash the non-rational rational thinkers. There are millions of us Democrats and Independents that would donate money to fund a deprogram The cult operation. It wouldn't hurt if Biden would use his bully pulpit also to spread the message of what life will be like in a capitalist dictatorship or any other kind of dictatorship. Only when the Cult figure out that they themselves will be envying the Dead, will they see the light. At the end of each television commercial there could be an address where we could donate money to to keep the commercials going.
Thanks for the efforts, but I have to take issue with one point.
Lies are cheap. Facts are expensive - but worth it. The truth is beyond us all, like goldfish in a bowl.
Lies are cheap -- it’s a profit thing, to quote Steve Martin in ‘The Jerk.’.
We can’t stop lies. We have to stop liars.
It’s the damned immigrants -- named Murdoch, at least two of them, who should not have been allowed.
That’s the challenge we face. We have to spend the money, somebody’s as you say, to be vigilant and deal with the networks of broadcast lies.
But lies are cheap. A lie could get halfway around the world before the truth could get its shoes on, according to a popular quote from the middle 1800s with just the newish telegraph.
Lies are not free speech, despite many failing claims by leading progressive lawmakers and professors.
( Progressive liberals give up before they get started, or don’t start, so many damn times . . . )
Some lies are too minor to be prosecuted, like minor speeding, and many are too expensive to prosecute, with the budget we have.
I’ve written repeatedly to Nick Hanauer, who seems to be on this mission, with his billions. No ack so far, very frustrating ( we met in person a couple of times, long ago, in Oregon )
We need the old laws and rules and structures about lying to the public on our public channels. Freedom of speech, not freedom of reach.
I also support flogging all liars in public. It is much cheaper but we can do both spread the truth and flog at the same time unless you want to live under a dictatorship which sounds like you may deserve.
What perfectly wonderful rational, logical, sensible, intelligent, and fully provable thinking and information. Case closed! Problem solved! Fret no more.
Let me start another one of my monthly letters to the local Las Vegas liberal Sun newspaper. They have a 250 word limit, however. But opinions from liberal/progressives and the paper's editors appear there daily. Millions of words. The reactionaries (who believe they are conservatives) do not read that section, or if they might browse briefly reject every word about 98% of the time. They have a mind-set, a belief system, and a counterpoint for every statement and argument deeply etched in their brain. They are true believers and they believe there is a war in progress of which the culture wars are only one small part. They are on the side of good in their minds. Permissive, liberal, scientific, and rational concepts are from people who do not understand the true state of the world and of human nature.
If only one "side" is at war and fighting with all its resources and will, the advantage is theirs. Reality is cruel and unsympathetic. Trump did not have the right to lie, even when he was ostensibly speaking politically or from his personal viewpoint. He was placed in a position of trust and power with an affirmative obligation to be truthful in all of his utterances and appearances. The fight is about demanding fidelity, truth, decency, and patriotic deeds and attitudes on the part of all our leaders. That must be our demand. But if we are not facing the reality of how our citizens are not well-informed and capable of discretion and aware of the workings of their own systems, we are still on square one. The Republicans cannot hear you and they do not give you the slightest credibility and we all already know that.
GIB, Thank you. I vacillate and equivocate because I am an inveterate optimist, despite many moments of cynicism and doubt. I am with Thom when he hopefully predicts that there will be a Democratic wave in 2024 because of Republican self-destruction and their extreme positions and anti-democratic efforts. I believe Trump will shrink to the inconsequential nobody that he has always been and fade from memory, driving many of the crackpots back underground. However, I see no great awakening or transformational cultural shift because the weaknesses in our systems and institutions and especially in our schooling are not being recognized by most, let alone addressed effectively and responsibly. In speaking about the British poor and middle classes during the 19th century, Edgar Z. Friedenberger says in his book, "The Disposal of Liberty and Other Industrial Wastes, "They were prevented from developing their moral sense by authoritarianism in the family and schools, and by the imposition of a code which deliberately confused convention with morality and endowed convention with greater authority." There is a striking parallel with the arbitrary authority in many of our families still and most of our schools, which equates learning with convention, acquiescence, propriety, and established knowledge. Critical thinking is talked about but impossible to integrate in top-down institutions with a curriculum approved by state officials whose interests conflict with those of citizens and citizen students.
Thanks for that Friedenberger reference and quote. Brilliant. So much of our state and social structures are emotional moebius cycles of repression disguised as Progress.
Moninna, Are you familiar with Friedenbeger? I read the book about 45 years ago and had seen it on my shelves until moving recently, when it seems to have disappeared during downsizing. I ordered a copy last week and have started re-reading it. He calls students, welfare recipients, prisoners, and others "conscript clienteles". Reading the reviews I began to question how well I understood him or recalled his positions and philosophy. My use of the word "ressentiment" for the last 40 years as internalized resentment does not seem to coincide exactly with the reviewer's interpretation and they categorize him differently. I have had him pegged as a liberal/progressive. A new look should clarify, although he is above my intellectual capacity much of the time and his writing is nuanced and a bit circuitous or sophisticated. There is no question that he has accurately identified the covert and often overt coercion in our institutions as a destroyer of liberty, autonomy, and morality, however. Kids know from day one that they are not experiencing anything resembling democracy.
Yikes. I think I just replied to you as a general comment. Oh well. Here I go again. Thanks for this and no, I was not familiar with Friedenberger. The quote ypu referenced seemed so apt for our currenr events but it looks like he might need to be understood within the limitations of his historical era and sociological motivations.
Might try and read his work once I have ploughed through the mountain of books I have put aside to ‘get to soon’.
Friedenberger’s book was published in 1975 but his descriptions of ressentiment apply very aptly to Trump cultists today. Here is a favorite quote that I just came across (pg. 72) that I had used many times in the past, which had somehow been left out of my more recent materials and writing.
“To feel a full, bitter measure of ressentiment, one must have become more than a victim; one must despise oneself for having consented to one’s own victimization and established it as the pattern of one’s life.”
Earlie he says,
“Exploitation assumes a particularly degrading quality in the modern state, for the victim must not only be used and often ill-used; he must be kept persuaded that such usage is in his best interests as a citizen--a refinement in mystification that would not have occurred to Attila the Hun.”
Over and over, he makes direct references to how citizens are “manipulated” in their “attitudes and understanding of events.” The primary mechanism for this perverted socialization in his analysis is schooling, which is mandatory ostensibly because there is an assumption that revolution would eventually take place without it. Again, he says (pg. 76):
“I have discussed very fully elsewhere the way in which the institutions that socialize the young, especially the school system, accustom them to a climate of ressentiment until they come to accept this as an essential characteristic of serious, adult life and, becoming ressentient themselves, they mistake this for the process of growing up.”
In the same paragraph, he goes on to say that the “process”
“…fixes in the minds and character of most, apparently irrevocably, a conception of work as something that is done to met the demands of other persons for pay.”
These are probably not the best samples from the book and I am still only about one-third of the way through the book. I do not believe that there is anyone writing today who understands and articulates these ideas as well, or who even comes close to explaining what we are experiencing now. It is essential for more people to put these things front and center and to stand in opposition to the mind-control which is mass-producing this destructive rancor. Incredibly, even Thom still appears to believe that traditional schools educate and adequately socialize, despite the overwhelming evidence to the contrary.
Right on Thom and thanks for laying it out so succinctly. Just wish his followers would read this. I will share but people don't read my facebook posts any longer
That certainly lays it out clearly for anyone who cares about the truth to understand. Unfortunately, there are millions who not only don't care, but prefer the lies. Thanks for a great read.
The freedom of speech con is so absurd in this situation imho.
45 was ON THE JOB for crying out loud! Does anyone on the job have the right to say whatever they want and keep their job? No! Has anyone questioned this to trumpers? If they shun facts, can they relate to job expectations? Lies and threatening coworkers is not a part of the job requirements of POTUS! He was on the job on Jan. 6!
The spin and non stop coverage on mainstream news is disgusting while the climate crisis rolls on, SCOTUS must be reigned in, big dark money out of politics, blatent corruption held accountable, so very much to do.
This oligarch ruse by their minions must be stomped out.
What about the financial cost of this con job to taxpayers? Court costs of all those unsuccesful lawsuits should have been and should be paid for by 45, the GOP and their supporters. Were they? Will they be? Citizens are being robbed and harmed while these oligarch games are being "played" nonstop in the manufactured reality TV show (formerly our government) played on FOX. Make them pay for their nonsense!
Bottom line, 45 was fired by the American people; because the GOP, while on the job, PAID BY CITIZENS, did not do their jobs! 45 came back at us for revenge not unlike a fired employee who returns with his assault rifle and kills his coworkers.
I am so ready for accountability for all involved with this continuing fraud on the people.
The prosecution of 45s assuault on us must be televised! ALL US citizens are victims of this ongoing scam!
The statute of limitations hasn't ran out for the 300 other GOP opportunities that were not prosecuted. There is a statute of limitation of 5 years for sedition and it looks like Garland is going to let it run out the Democrats could have took back the house and supreme Court by now I suspect Biden in the Democrat leadership are in on this coup of course with the press as well.
Thom's reasoning is solid as a rock when it comes to explaining Trump's plight and how it is hardly weaponization of government or unfairness, etc. that is bringing down MAGAism.
The only flaw in Thom's reasoning is thinking that any of his letter might trigger critical reasoning in a MAGA. Kellyanne Conway taught them how to rationalize facts that refute their beliefs. They will call Thom's facts lies. When irrefutable, they will move the goal posts to declare a "gotcha." When those tactics fail, they will unleash a torrent of "yeahbut's."
What motivates this MAGA denialism? As a psychologist my favorite hypothesis is that MAGAs are not happy with their lives and want relief from the pain of the regrettable choices they made which contributed to their current misery. Along comes a fake messiah who promises to turn regret into redemption. Even their evangelical pastors endorse his lies as dogma.
Blaming others is often the easiest way to try to offload regret. "It is those radical socialist (aka communist) Democrats and their policies that caused me to lose my job that time, or fail to get a promotion because some Asian guy got it instead, or other life setbacks. Now especially, as the SS Trump is listing in the water of justice, the MAGA faithful must cling to their dogma or accept yet another regrettable life choice.
You have articulated the facts well. It has been read my many, if not mostly Democrats, possibly some Independents, but few if any in DJT’s cult of zombie-like followers. The rich honchos who are funding him will, for now, continue. For them it’s like purchasing a seat at club-only members theater. That said, this article gives people a lot of snippets to use when exchanging with Trump leaning people to help make a point or two. Usually, exchanging with them turns into waring with them and nobody comes away with a satisfied result.
I will continue to post on several social media’s and email a growing list of people who are willing to work toward a successful 2024 election. After all, the price we pay for our freedoms is our eternal vigilance. We must work, in what ever way is within our means, to elect people who will defend them.
Thank you for this wonderful , clear synopsis of what is on our ‘stage’ at this moment.
This tsunami of breaking news, exits us all !
Words Matter” is the title of the piece I am writing for OEN - and to open my blog at Substack.
It is beyond ironic, that from the Don, comes “IF YOU GO AFTER ME I AM COMING AFTER YOU!”
He is quite clear as to his intentions -- as he always is! THAT is a known quality which the brilliant Jack Smith is going to showcase on the stage of our highest court.
What needs to end — in this transformational era where information technology allows the instant transmission of lies to millions— is that blog of his, ironically named “TRUTH Social !”
That media networks (like Fox and NewsMax ) disseminate lies twisted to sound like ‘news’ exacerbates the problem!
A stressed citizenry, is already overwhelmed by this endless narrative which describes a lawless, malevolent criminal , who has never paid the piper for his antics.
If a child behaves in a way that is hurtful, or unethical, the parent shows that this behavior is unacceptable, by putting the child in a “time-out “ — in order to think about what just happened!!
It’s hard to allow one’s child to cry.
But they recover, with a sense of discovery!
Don’t do this again.!
I am a very successful teacher! 1998 “NYSEC Educator of Excellence.”
YES, I rewarded achievement! Harvard said that every child in my class learned, because I set “CLEAR Expectations “ -- the first “Principle of Learning “ -- when I was the NYC classroom cohort for their thesis on Learning
... the first “principle of Learning “ is critical.
If a human child does not realize what behavior is expected, if successful work is to be achieved, then
One gets a donaldtrump!
My students knew that the rewards depended on ethical, conscientious behavior…. And that egregious behaviors were unacceptable… and inexcusable!
It is time that our Judiciary make it clear to MR. Trump, that what he did was not merely unacceptable—- it was unconstitutional!
It is time for our people to grasp what our Founders meant by Freedom of Speech!
AND
It is time to regulate social media platforms which use this guise of ‘Free Speech’to ferment not merely division, but violence.
And it is time, to condemn entertainment networks that promote lies, and call it “news!”
One way, is for everyone to refuse to purchase or use products or services promoted on that network, if they do not present accurate details and information to back up their rhetoric.
So, tonight, at 5 pm, we will learn how our judiciary is going to protect our citizens, who testify and judge this criminal who would be King of America, so he could Do Anything He Wants!
Thom, on the ROKU channel (ROKU Streaming) there are some informative documentaries on Hitler. There are the Occult histories and a couple as to “How I Did It”, in Hitler’s own words. Trump’s playbook.
Thanks again Thom -- One point that I don't hear often enough is that Don T did not pardon the capitol attackers. He didn't even try. He had plenty of time and staff.
He brays that he is the only one protecting his followers -- but he did not, in the most glaring and obvious opportunity.
Why? Knowing the s-o-b, because they did not succeed. No surprise, but also noting that I wouldn't expect him to help them even if they did succeed. That would fit.
The capitol attackers are all under prosecution or in prison. Don T did not pay for their defense either, to my knowledge. He has the PAC money, though how that can be used for legal expenses . . . doesn't seem truly legal to me.
Don T did not help when it was needed most, never mind the rest of the time. This is the kind of talking point that I want the fake news to hate so much that they try to debunk it.
That sows the doubt, when the topic comes up at all, in the bubble.
Still remembering -- it's not about Don T -- it's about the people who vote for him, and the Rs, who vote against themselves, and their family, and the rest of US. -- best luck to US, b.rad
ps have to throw in more bait -- Fake hair, fake tan, fake smile, fake money-- he's a fake man.
pps - still haven't heard any effort to expose those who held the Capitol Police back, per a White House plan as I understand things, and especially those who knowingly and deliberately prevented the National Guard from showing up, Flynn's brother et al
have to throw in more bait -- Fake hair, fake tan, fake smile, fake money-- he's a fake man.
Yes, indeed! A fake man with gold toilets..........if nothing else.......should that not give us reason for pause? A huge clue.......idolatry on display.
I've said for years: "Trump supporters don't care if he lies TO them as long as he keeps lying FOR them." They love him for his ability to get away with it. What we find most appalling about him—the deceit, the arrogance, the hate and racism, the corruption and hypocrisy—are precisely what they find most appealing. But what's really frightening is their shared addiction to revenge, as this article explains: https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2020/12/12/trump-grievance-addiction-444570
What is more frightening to me is that most of his supporters do not even understand that he is harming them. To be that unworldly and unaware is just dangerous in this world. The fact that as long as Trump and his ilk, which he has bred in the Republican party by going over the line again and again and again until the norms are some twisted version of reality, and evilness is goodness. That we are unreliable internationally because whatever Biden does, people know that he can be replaced by Trump and only isolated people and the young would not know how dangerous he is globally. Despots love it because he destabilizes the USA, and invites them in to our secrets and destroys our security. It is hard enough to be secure in this day and age of endless internet exposure. I recently found this out the hard way as a parent, and am still reeling from it. Evil = Good in the Republican Party that has been made in Trumps image. A twisted villain of a person who can create goodness out of evil by telling compelling stories that feed the egos of his followers just as Putin does. The great former empire that they both want to restore is the world in a time before dental care, and modern surgery. Let them live in those good old days on their own.
Excellent commentary Thom. Dead center bulls -eye hits on the malignancy that is tRump and his con job on Americans. It’s all about the grift, Republican grifters all surrounding the tRump orbit cloaked in delusional Americanisms and fake patriotic BS. Yup, the “gullibles” really bought the cool aid fix, even dying for it by believing the BS during the worst pandemic of our lifetime. I’m in indictment heaven waiting for the tRump trials and the imploding of the Republican Party. I don’t believe the MSM hysteria that tRump will magically win 2024. He’s toast! Thank goodness for our legal system and the sheer professionalism of Jack Smith. Get the popcorn ready!
Ah yes the fake patriotism. These treasonous bastards, disprespect the flag, that they claim to love.
I was driving along a road, when I saw a house with a flag pole and a worn, dirty, barely readable flag. I see quite a few (a rural community), and all the flags are on poles and are tattered and.or dirty. Total disrespect for the flag, As is wearing as a bikini, a swim suit a wigdana,
Title 8 USC forbids these kinds of displays. The MFers use the flag as a crutch, just as they use the USA,USA chant.
To be fair, three letters may be the limit of their spelling ability.
Two syllable words certainly is.
Laughing out loud
And their Savior Jesus is just a credit card to sin with.
LOL. As an atheist who, under family pressure (my uncle in whose house I lived, was a southern B aptist preacher, required me to attend church on Sunday and Wednesday, then years later I married a Catholic, and of course had to go through, that process, and attend Catholic church.
I found that both scams had a thing in common, besides using their god as a sock puppet, and that is forgiveness, to serve them from hellfire and damnation.
Seven years if cognitive dissonance, proclaiming to be a Catholic, was too much, back to who I really was, a skeptic and an atheist.
With the Catholics, you can kill someone, go to confession, say a few hail Mary's and Our fathers as an act of contrition, and good to go, do it again, until the next time you go to confession.
With the Baptists, you just stand up, walk to the pulpit, and declare you are a sinner, without specifying the sin, and the put hands on you, and voila born again, and again, and again and again.
The rational Trump supporters won't admit they were wrong, and the irrational ones need to be reprogrammed for the I'm the cult. I'm doubtful anything objective gets through to them. My Republican friends have gone very quiet on the subject of Trump.
You have Republican friends.? I will skip the overused analogies.
It’s the Chump Party now -- we need to tell them.
Just a juvenile insult? Yep. Spot on, though. That’s talking their language, it’s Don T’s only mode. maybe it could get through to enough of them.
best luck to US -- b.rad
ps which cult? I bet auto incorrect ( ‘AI’ ) changed your term . . .
Excellent work as usual, but I keep thinking about a dinner that I just had with a good friend. She is well educated and very open minded about many things (and incidentally has several gay siblings whom she loves dearly). But about Trump, "He wasn't responsible for January 6th," "He's working for those who don't have much," "He's fighting the woke radicals," and so on and so on. Facts don't matter, it is perception. Try convincing a person taken in by a Ponzi scheme, a cult (which incidentally the Republicans are), a well organized gang, or any other group that offers stability, the sense of empowerment, and an answer to life, preferably with a leader who offers certainty. People can be, and are, deprogrammed all the time. But sheer facts rarely do it.
Not just change the channel, but stop funding him. I agree with Kathy that it's all about the grift, keeping the grift going. Probably why Trump has his lawyer trying to assuage his base a little longer, in an attempt to keep the funds coming for as long as possible.
Fraud almost always involves speech: it’s hard to defraud somebody out of something without talking to or at them. But that doesn’t even remotely make it protected by the First Amendment’s free speech provision. Our prisons are filled with people who defrauded others purely with their words.
I love this comment, Thom! I was sickened watching dt's lawyer being interviewed Sunday by Chuck Todd and George Stephanopoulos repeatedly and smugly commenting that this was all a free speech issue and blaming the Biden Admin for charges being brought against Trump.
Your comment about our prisons being filled with people who defrauded others needs to hammered in with TV/cable adds. I also wish you could go on national TV and present your whole article as a Public Service Announcement!
Why couldn't George or Chuck respond to dt's lawyer, "the Biden admin had nothing to do with these charges" or, "the line on free speech is crossed when a person is using it to defraud others".
I guess I'll just have to have faith that our justice systems proves that at dt's trial.
China has about a thousand billionaires 1/3 more than America. The cultist believe the Chinese are communist despite the facts that China is a capitalist dictatorship like Russia and Saudi Arabia and almost all the failed third world Nations. The cultist also believe Trump won the election despite the facts. In order to deprogram the cultists, we must present them with the facts over and over and over again and point out what their future will be like living under a capitalist dictatorship. Where they have no rights or freedom. Where they can be turned into slaves, starved, tortured, no social spending, their organs harvested, their children used as sex slaves, where they drink poisoned polluted water and food and drugs. We must not forget chopped up in a bathroom also. The only way we can possibly reach them, is through buying up commercials and donating money to fund the commercials. The commercials could be on the cheap antenna TV channels, the Western channels the country music channels the NASCAR channels the rodeo channels. The truth is cheaper to spread than lies. For probably 1/10 of money we could undo whatbthe billionaires have spent over a trillion trying to successfully brainwash the non-rational rational thinkers. There are millions of us Democrats and Independents that would donate money to fund a deprogram The cult operation. It wouldn't hurt if Biden would use his bully pulpit also to spread the message of what life will be like in a capitalist dictatorship or any other kind of dictatorship. Only when the Cult figure out that they themselves will be envying the Dead, will they see the light. At the end of each television commercial there could be an address where we could donate money to to keep the commercials going.
Thanks for the efforts, but I have to take issue with one point.
Lies are cheap. Facts are expensive - but worth it. The truth is beyond us all, like goldfish in a bowl.
Lies are cheap -- it’s a profit thing, to quote Steve Martin in ‘The Jerk.’.
We can’t stop lies. We have to stop liars.
It’s the damned immigrants -- named Murdoch, at least two of them, who should not have been allowed.
That’s the challenge we face. We have to spend the money, somebody’s as you say, to be vigilant and deal with the networks of broadcast lies.
But lies are cheap. A lie could get halfway around the world before the truth could get its shoes on, according to a popular quote from the middle 1800s with just the newish telegraph.
Lies are not free speech, despite many failing claims by leading progressive lawmakers and professors.
( Progressive liberals give up before they get started, or don’t start, so many damn times . . . )
Some lies are too minor to be prosecuted, like minor speeding, and many are too expensive to prosecute, with the budget we have.
I’ve written repeatedly to Nick Hanauer, who seems to be on this mission, with his billions. No ack so far, very frustrating ( we met in person a couple of times, long ago, in Oregon )
We need the old laws and rules and structures about lying to the public on our public channels. Freedom of speech, not freedom of reach.
We can’t stop lies. We have to stop liars.
best luck to US, b.rad
I also support flogging all liars in public. It is much cheaper but we can do both spread the truth and flog at the same time unless you want to live under a dictatorship which sounds like you may deserve.
What perfectly wonderful rational, logical, sensible, intelligent, and fully provable thinking and information. Case closed! Problem solved! Fret no more.
Let me start another one of my monthly letters to the local Las Vegas liberal Sun newspaper. They have a 250 word limit, however. But opinions from liberal/progressives and the paper's editors appear there daily. Millions of words. The reactionaries (who believe they are conservatives) do not read that section, or if they might browse briefly reject every word about 98% of the time. They have a mind-set, a belief system, and a counterpoint for every statement and argument deeply etched in their brain. They are true believers and they believe there is a war in progress of which the culture wars are only one small part. They are on the side of good in their minds. Permissive, liberal, scientific, and rational concepts are from people who do not understand the true state of the world and of human nature.
If only one "side" is at war and fighting with all its resources and will, the advantage is theirs. Reality is cruel and unsympathetic. Trump did not have the right to lie, even when he was ostensibly speaking politically or from his personal viewpoint. He was placed in a position of trust and power with an affirmative obligation to be truthful in all of his utterances and appearances. The fight is about demanding fidelity, truth, decency, and patriotic deeds and attitudes on the part of all our leaders. That must be our demand. But if we are not facing the reality of how our citizens are not well-informed and capable of discretion and aware of the workings of their own systems, we are still on square one. The Republicans cannot hear you and they do not give you the slightest credibility and we all already know that.
You definitely have a clear grasp on why our problems aren't solved! You are depressingly accurate.
GIB, Thank you. I vacillate and equivocate because I am an inveterate optimist, despite many moments of cynicism and doubt. I am with Thom when he hopefully predicts that there will be a Democratic wave in 2024 because of Republican self-destruction and their extreme positions and anti-democratic efforts. I believe Trump will shrink to the inconsequential nobody that he has always been and fade from memory, driving many of the crackpots back underground. However, I see no great awakening or transformational cultural shift because the weaknesses in our systems and institutions and especially in our schooling are not being recognized by most, let alone addressed effectively and responsibly. In speaking about the British poor and middle classes during the 19th century, Edgar Z. Friedenberger says in his book, "The Disposal of Liberty and Other Industrial Wastes, "They were prevented from developing their moral sense by authoritarianism in the family and schools, and by the imposition of a code which deliberately confused convention with morality and endowed convention with greater authority." There is a striking parallel with the arbitrary authority in many of our families still and most of our schools, which equates learning with convention, acquiescence, propriety, and established knowledge. Critical thinking is talked about but impossible to integrate in top-down institutions with a curriculum approved by state officials whose interests conflict with those of citizens and citizen students.
Thanks for that Friedenberger reference and quote. Brilliant. So much of our state and social structures are emotional moebius cycles of repression disguised as Progress.
Moninna, Are you familiar with Friedenbeger? I read the book about 45 years ago and had seen it on my shelves until moving recently, when it seems to have disappeared during downsizing. I ordered a copy last week and have started re-reading it. He calls students, welfare recipients, prisoners, and others "conscript clienteles". Reading the reviews I began to question how well I understood him or recalled his positions and philosophy. My use of the word "ressentiment" for the last 40 years as internalized resentment does not seem to coincide exactly with the reviewer's interpretation and they categorize him differently. I have had him pegged as a liberal/progressive. A new look should clarify, although he is above my intellectual capacity much of the time and his writing is nuanced and a bit circuitous or sophisticated. There is no question that he has accurately identified the covert and often overt coercion in our institutions as a destroyer of liberty, autonomy, and morality, however. Kids know from day one that they are not experiencing anything resembling democracy.
Yikes. I think I just replied to you as a general comment. Oh well. Here I go again. Thanks for this and no, I was not familiar with Friedenberger. The quote ypu referenced seemed so apt for our currenr events but it looks like he might need to be understood within the limitations of his historical era and sociological motivations.
Might try and read his work once I have ploughed through the mountain of books I have put aside to ‘get to soon’.
🐈⬛
Moninna,
Friedenberger’s book was published in 1975 but his descriptions of ressentiment apply very aptly to Trump cultists today. Here is a favorite quote that I just came across (pg. 72) that I had used many times in the past, which had somehow been left out of my more recent materials and writing.
“To feel a full, bitter measure of ressentiment, one must have become more than a victim; one must despise oneself for having consented to one’s own victimization and established it as the pattern of one’s life.”
Earlie he says,
“Exploitation assumes a particularly degrading quality in the modern state, for the victim must not only be used and often ill-used; he must be kept persuaded that such usage is in his best interests as a citizen--a refinement in mystification that would not have occurred to Attila the Hun.”
Over and over, he makes direct references to how citizens are “manipulated” in their “attitudes and understanding of events.” The primary mechanism for this perverted socialization in his analysis is schooling, which is mandatory ostensibly because there is an assumption that revolution would eventually take place without it. Again, he says (pg. 76):
“I have discussed very fully elsewhere the way in which the institutions that socialize the young, especially the school system, accustom them to a climate of ressentiment until they come to accept this as an essential characteristic of serious, adult life and, becoming ressentient themselves, they mistake this for the process of growing up.”
In the same paragraph, he goes on to say that the “process”
“…fixes in the minds and character of most, apparently irrevocably, a conception of work as something that is done to met the demands of other persons for pay.”
These are probably not the best samples from the book and I am still only about one-third of the way through the book. I do not believe that there is anyone writing today who understands and articulates these ideas as well, or who even comes close to explaining what we are experiencing now. It is essential for more people to put these things front and center and to stand in opposition to the mind-control which is mass-producing this destructive rancor. Incredibly, even Thom still appears to believe that traditional schools educate and adequately socialize, despite the overwhelming evidence to the contrary.
Right on Thom and thanks for laying it out so succinctly. Just wish his followers would read this. I will share but people don't read my facebook posts any longer
That certainly lays it out clearly for anyone who cares about the truth to understand. Unfortunately, there are millions who not only don't care, but prefer the lies. Thanks for a great read.
The freedom of speech con is so absurd in this situation imho.
45 was ON THE JOB for crying out loud! Does anyone on the job have the right to say whatever they want and keep their job? No! Has anyone questioned this to trumpers? If they shun facts, can they relate to job expectations? Lies and threatening coworkers is not a part of the job requirements of POTUS! He was on the job on Jan. 6!
The spin and non stop coverage on mainstream news is disgusting while the climate crisis rolls on, SCOTUS must be reigned in, big dark money out of politics, blatent corruption held accountable, so very much to do.
This oligarch ruse by their minions must be stomped out.
What about the financial cost of this con job to taxpayers? Court costs of all those unsuccesful lawsuits should have been and should be paid for by 45, the GOP and their supporters. Were they? Will they be? Citizens are being robbed and harmed while these oligarch games are being "played" nonstop in the manufactured reality TV show (formerly our government) played on FOX. Make them pay for their nonsense!
Bottom line, 45 was fired by the American people; because the GOP, while on the job, PAID BY CITIZENS, did not do their jobs! 45 came back at us for revenge not unlike a fired employee who returns with his assault rifle and kills his coworkers.
I am so ready for accountability for all involved with this continuing fraud on the people.
The prosecution of 45s assuault on us must be televised! ALL US citizens are victims of this ongoing scam!
Keep up the fight dear progressives!
The statute of limitations hasn't ran out for the 300 other GOP opportunities that were not prosecuted. There is a statute of limitation of 5 years for sedition and it looks like Garland is going to let it run out the Democrats could have took back the house and supreme Court by now I suspect Biden in the Democrat leadership are in on this coup of course with the press as well.
Thom's reasoning is solid as a rock when it comes to explaining Trump's plight and how it is hardly weaponization of government or unfairness, etc. that is bringing down MAGAism.
The only flaw in Thom's reasoning is thinking that any of his letter might trigger critical reasoning in a MAGA. Kellyanne Conway taught them how to rationalize facts that refute their beliefs. They will call Thom's facts lies. When irrefutable, they will move the goal posts to declare a "gotcha." When those tactics fail, they will unleash a torrent of "yeahbut's."
What motivates this MAGA denialism? As a psychologist my favorite hypothesis is that MAGAs are not happy with their lives and want relief from the pain of the regrettable choices they made which contributed to their current misery. Along comes a fake messiah who promises to turn regret into redemption. Even their evangelical pastors endorse his lies as dogma.
Blaming others is often the easiest way to try to offload regret. "It is those radical socialist (aka communist) Democrats and their policies that caused me to lose my job that time, or fail to get a promotion because some Asian guy got it instead, or other life setbacks. Now especially, as the SS Trump is listing in the water of justice, the MAGA faithful must cling to their dogma or accept yet another regrettable life choice.
You have articulated the facts well. It has been read my many, if not mostly Democrats, possibly some Independents, but few if any in DJT’s cult of zombie-like followers. The rich honchos who are funding him will, for now, continue. For them it’s like purchasing a seat at club-only members theater. That said, this article gives people a lot of snippets to use when exchanging with Trump leaning people to help make a point or two. Usually, exchanging with them turns into waring with them and nobody comes away with a satisfied result.
I will continue to post on several social media’s and email a growing list of people who are willing to work toward a successful 2024 election. After all, the price we pay for our freedoms is our eternal vigilance. We must work, in what ever way is within our means, to elect people who will defend them.
Dear Thom,
Thank you for this wonderful , clear synopsis of what is on our ‘stage’ at this moment.
This tsunami of breaking news, exits us all !
Words Matter” is the title of the piece I am writing for OEN - and to open my blog at Substack.
It is beyond ironic, that from the Don, comes “IF YOU GO AFTER ME I AM COMING AFTER YOU!”
He is quite clear as to his intentions -- as he always is! THAT is a known quality which the brilliant Jack Smith is going to showcase on the stage of our highest court.
What needs to end — in this transformational era where information technology allows the instant transmission of lies to millions— is that blog of his, ironically named “TRUTH Social !”
That media networks (like Fox and NewsMax ) disseminate lies twisted to sound like ‘news’ exacerbates the problem!
A stressed citizenry, is already overwhelmed by this endless narrative which describes a lawless, malevolent criminal , who has never paid the piper for his antics.
If a child behaves in a way that is hurtful, or unethical, the parent shows that this behavior is unacceptable, by putting the child in a “time-out “ — in order to think about what just happened!!
It’s hard to allow one’s child to cry.
But they recover, with a sense of discovery!
Don’t do this again.!
I am a very successful teacher! 1998 “NYSEC Educator of Excellence.”
YES, I rewarded achievement! Harvard said that every child in my class learned, because I set “CLEAR Expectations “ -- the first “Principle of Learning “ -- when I was the NYC classroom cohort for their thesis on Learning
... the first “principle of Learning “ is critical.
If a human child does not realize what behavior is expected, if successful work is to be achieved, then
One gets a donaldtrump!
My students knew that the rewards depended on ethical, conscientious behavior…. And that egregious behaviors were unacceptable… and inexcusable!
It is time that our Judiciary make it clear to MR. Trump, that what he did was not merely unacceptable—- it was unconstitutional!
It is time for our people to grasp what our Founders meant by Freedom of Speech!
AND
It is time to regulate social media platforms which use this guise of ‘Free Speech’to ferment not merely division, but violence.
And it is time, to condemn entertainment networks that promote lies, and call it “news!”
One way, is for everyone to refuse to purchase or use products or services promoted on that network, if they do not present accurate details and information to back up their rhetoric.
So, tonight, at 5 pm, we will learn how our judiciary is going to protect our citizens, who testify and judge this criminal who would be King of America, so he could Do Anything He Wants!
Thom, on the ROKU channel (ROKU Streaming) there are some informative documentaries on Hitler. There are the Occult histories and a couple as to “How I Did It”, in Hitler’s own words. Trump’s playbook.
Thanks again Thom -- One point that I don't hear often enough is that Don T did not pardon the capitol attackers. He didn't even try. He had plenty of time and staff.
He brays that he is the only one protecting his followers -- but he did not, in the most glaring and obvious opportunity.
Why? Knowing the s-o-b, because they did not succeed. No surprise, but also noting that I wouldn't expect him to help them even if they did succeed. That would fit.
The capitol attackers are all under prosecution or in prison. Don T did not pay for their defense either, to my knowledge. He has the PAC money, though how that can be used for legal expenses . . . doesn't seem truly legal to me.
Don T did not help when it was needed most, never mind the rest of the time. This is the kind of talking point that I want the fake news to hate so much that they try to debunk it.
That sows the doubt, when the topic comes up at all, in the bubble.
Still remembering -- it's not about Don T -- it's about the people who vote for him, and the Rs, who vote against themselves, and their family, and the rest of US. -- best luck to US, b.rad
ps have to throw in more bait -- Fake hair, fake tan, fake smile, fake money-- he's a fake man.
pps - still haven't heard any effort to expose those who held the Capitol Police back, per a White House plan as I understand things, and especially those who knowingly and deliberately prevented the National Guard from showing up, Flynn's brother et al
Trump not coming to the aid of his wounded warriors would be a great topic to bring up to his ardent followers, constantly.
have to throw in more bait -- Fake hair, fake tan, fake smile, fake money-- he's a fake man.
Yes, indeed! A fake man with gold toilets..........if nothing else.......should that not give us reason for pause? A huge clue.......idolatry on display.