Was there a conspiracy — even if it only involved a handful of people — at the highest levels of our government to end the American Experiment that was only defeated by sheer luck?
I was quick to like your post this morning, even before thoroughly reading it, because I’ve been asking myself this for a few years also. I began to wonder this during the protests following George Floyd being killed, as I watched the actions of many law enforcement against peaceful protesters. I confess, though I know the sentiments causing this tension on both sides, I was shocked to see the brutality used against protesters and journalists. Documented by local journalists, with scant if any coverage on MSM, this got my attention and was very alarming. It’s one thing to do your duty under a command; but what I witnessed at times was clearly rageful, self-righteous zealousness to crush the dissent. And doing it with anonymity, as opposed to doing it for public attention. This was much scarier than manipulation of the ‘cult of personality’ type; this was clearly action based on the assumption that they had the right to take charge.
Over a 30 year period I’ve watched this mentality change among a veteran population, as a psychologist and trauma specialist working closely with traumatized combat veterans. I did not understand what I was seeing, hearing and feeling change in many of them, or some of the police officers who had for years been good and trusted colleagues. But as Faux News blared out of almost every television, and most of us were just keeping our noses to the ground doing the hard work, there WERE nefarious players at work actively manipulating these good and honest people. Christian Nationalists and other white supremacists were deliberately lying to them, to inflame their passions about things that weren’t even happening and win them to their side. I used to assume that the “people at the top” were smarter than me and certainly knew truth from lies, could see that a yellow journalism effort like Faux news was just that, and would do something to help their young soldiers and staff from falling victim to the propaganda. For myself, I no longer believe those things. On Jan 7, 2021 I had a family member call me to ‘thank me’ for having tried to explain this to them: I barely registered what they meant. But for years I had been alarmed at what I felt and was seeing, and had apparently tried to describe it, though I didn’t understand it yet myself.
As always, thanks for this upsetting but important writing this morning, Thom. Its clarity, thoroughness, conciseness and provocativeness are signature to your good writing and thoughtfulness. I wish you could have put these good talents to more fun use, but for our country, I’m glad you’ve been using them as you have for all these years.
One if the many reasons I subscribe to your newsletter is that you have a way of tying pertinent details into a larger framework of events, so that plot points are not lost to the passage of time. I believe the chain of command on January 6 was part of the coup. How did I know? Some rando on Twitter? Because MAGA rhetoric all over social media said they were going to DC on January 6 (not Jan 1 or 14th) & often mentioned Jesus, 1776, the Storm,etc. There is no doubt in my mind that the bros Gens Flynn see themselves as “Patriot Christian Evangelics “ returning USA to God,in much the same style as Russia or Hungary, have done. Of course, there are members of the military & law enforcement who feel the same way about “faith, family, & 2A” and are absolutely willing to establish a harsh, repressed nation in order to achieve “gods glory”-the same promises made to isis terrorists.
Moreover, I’m not sure where Ginni & Clarence Thomas belong on the list of Jan 6 schemers, but it is crystal clear that they are “off limits” to press…for now. I hope that you & other highly sought after voices, will continue to dig into that duo. We only know the tip of the spear about the corruption on Scotus! Dig dig!
You are not alone. I have been viewing this 'quiet conspiracy' as likely since the start. During the following two years with the information drip, drip, drip, the odds of policing participation has only increased. Officers and military all wiping their records was my final straw. They were not simply accommodators - but had become active members of a massive cover-up.
RE: "Why are so few people openly speculating that corrupt individuals — possibly only a tiny handful — within the FBI, Secret Service, and Department of Defense may have participated in a plot led by Donald Trump to overthrow our government?"
Remember back after the Watergate break-in, there were only two reporters spending hours and dollars digging into what happened and even their co-workers initially didn't believe them. They were allowed to persist in spite of the cost.
And that was back before all the media consolidation and conversion of news deparments into entertainment profit centers. Don't forget what the CBS CEO said in 2016, 'DJT may be bad for American but he's great for he bottom line.' Don't forget that the Telecommunications Act of 1996 allowed this consolidation and ownership by oligarchs.
MSM is a big part of why this conspiracy is being ignored. Your show and FSTV exist because of the failure of MSM to inform. Back in 1986, after being fired by MSNBC for NOT supporting the WAR in Iraq, Jeff Cohen created FAIR.org, https://fair.org, to start documenting the new goal of MSM to misinform citizens directly and indirectly by NOT reporting some topics, like coup attempts by billionaires.
MSM is ignoring the conspiracy becuase they are part of it. MSM is ignoring the conspiracy because their oligarch owners are part of the conspiracy. MSM is ignoring the conspiracy because they don't want to reveal their co-conspirators in Congress and the Executive branch, or the billionaires who fund such conspiracies. Just as the funders/planners of the coup effort in 1933 of FDR were spared being held accountable, today's conspiracy funders will pay to stay free to finalize their coup of our democracy. They will placate us by reporting on the low level minions who were caught on video and are now being convicted of sedition.
Once again you have pointed out the obvious; at least to those of us who look at the whole picture and not just the frame. The change of the Secretary of Defense was a sure harbinger of the forthcoming trouble's. I truly believe-as you have written- that we were damn lucky. Meanwhile; we surly need to keep our eyes on the storm ahead. The headlines of two articles in RawStory today portend big trouble brewing. "Is this the new face of MAGA." "RNC taps right-wing extremists to lead group tasked to expand GOP appeal."
Thank you, Thom, for putting together what we should never forget. Too often we become lost in today's battle, when the first one has never truly been called out for what it was - treason. How many coincidences benefiting those who smell of treason does it take to be called what it is? How many blatantly deliberate acts that furthered the violence of Jan. 6 does it take to see that Jan. 6 was our Fort Sumter. There were no dupes. Everyone in the room knew enough that they had to make a decision; become a working part of the machine, go along with it sans resistance and hope it didn't bite them too hard in the end, resign and stay out of it, or resign and tell the truth to people who can make it real for the rest of us.
Well said Thom!! I have been wondering for months now about the probability of a larger conspiracy. And I share your disbelief that much of what seems like quite obvious evidence of such, (The Christopher Miller memo), has not been brought up by the mainstream Press or even the January 6th Committee. I suspect the tendrils or this conspiracy reach far into the military and law enforcement agencies!
I’ll never forget how surreal it felt watching the insurrection unfold on Jan 6, but in the back of my mind was where the hell is the National Guard. And when they finally arrived, what the hell took so long. All throughout the Jan 6 committee hearings I kept wondering if they were ever going to talk about it, but there was nothing. Rightfully a lot of the focus was on the former president but almost nothing on the involvement of other members of the government. It’s as if it’s all the rest is being swept under the rug. How will we prevent this from happening again if we don’t know the full extent of what happened?
This is a conspiracy out in the open. Our federal and local police forces are not only infiltrated with confederates it is the very system they are a part of. While Thom you will no discuss defunding the police because Barack Obama and Democratic Party leadership mock this salient policy demand it is the only real way to protect us against a militarized and totalitarian occupying force. Instead political expediency has Biden boasting about "funding the police" and adding 100,000 more officers to the force. The response to BLM versus the response to confederate traitors says it all, and until we have voices that have a megaphone who are courageous enough to call for the proper public policy response, and that is defunding the police, this cancer of support for white supremacy and oppression of black and brown communities will only get worse.
Some excellent journalism here. As Brendan Brown said, keep digging; don't let this get buried. Googled where Chris Miller is now; he seems to want to keep a low profile; the "dog" doesn't want to feed this story. If no one else is held accountable, he needs to be - as the "acting" head of defence under Trump, he's got the info, and was responsible for all the missing evidence, the missing texts & emails.
You started this Report brilliantly - the Sherlock Holmes bit was perfect, and set the tone for the whole article. It could set the tone for the entire 1/6 investigation - What were those dogs up to??
I was very suspicious when tfg fired Mark Esper and installed Chris Miller along with several of his other lackeys in the Pentagon . I think it’s obvious there was a plan/conspiracy involving the Flynn brothers as well. I was suspicious then, especially when the letter to the National Guard was sent. I’m convinced now it was a seditious conspiracy involving the trump installed military “leaders”
Excellent article! This, should be Exhibit 1 every time it's a Democrat's turn at the mic in the 6,285, or so, investigations planned in the Republican House for the next two years...or longer, depending.
It's an unstoppable force meeting an immovable object -- a story too big to contain but also too big not to. The Democratic minority in a House divided has the most wonderful of opportunities to use the strength of their opponent to their own advantage, like in jiu-jitsu.
From Scott Spade (pen author). in the case of controversies, I like to think in terms of my "personal probability" of some proposed action or event like the scenario proposed here--widespread conspiracy (yes or no) in terms of the $$ that I would be willing to wager given "favorable" odds (based on my biased opinion). In the historic example of Jan 6, I assign the probability to "yes" to 90% because of the many data points provided by Thom and his reader comments. Let me just add to one more issue that seems to me to be under-reported, at least in the progressive media. What about all the federal officials/employees/politicians who were (or are) waiting on the sidelines to see which side is "winning." (let's call them Whimps). In particular, perhaps the Justice Department (especially the FBI), employs a number of Whimps, who expected (or still expect) awareness/importance the Jan 6 event to be quickly forgotten. Maybe the painfully slow response of the Justice Department between Jan 6 and 2022 was partly the result of semi-roadblocks instigated by these of the "wait and see" (Whimp) crowd, e.g., Christopher Wray. Hopefully, the modified investigation headed by the special council Jack Smith will place an appropriate information barrier between the "new" investigation and the "dirty hands" of the Whimps. My note of historical context: I once wrote a novel about the 1960's and 70's in which I imagined the transfer of fantastic information (from an insider/whistle blower) to a "hero" about things that were considered fantastic delusions at the time by the mainstream, but later turned out to be true: CIA/Mafia collaboration, the real story of Cuban missile crisis, widespread FBI/Hoover extra-legal actions, cover-ups on all and every levels, etc. History may not repeat itself exactly, but parallels to the 1930's and 40's or again in the 1960's and 70's make for compelling drama, unfortunately including the nightmares.
One word answer: YES, but not just at the 'highest levels' the rot is throughout the individual states as well as the federal government in its entirety. The government was never "infiltrated by communists", a deceased WW2 vet friend of mine once said after 911: "we won the battles of WW2 but lost the war against fascism, government and business has been almost completely infiltrated by fascists. This started way before f__kface #45; I propose that the plot to overthrow the US Democracy started all the way back to post reconstruction.
Certainly a straight line can be drawn from the Robber Barons busted trusts (T Roosevelt & H Taft) resentments bolstered by 'Birth of the Nation' Woodrow Wilson who cemented the "white supremacists" holdovers from the US Civil war. The White Supremacists (Christen Nationalists, Aryan Nation, NAZI, KKK, and the relatively new Oath Keepers and boogalo Boys) were and are still an open secret when I was in the Military in the 70's, just as much as the propensity for the 'bullies' of all stripes are attracted to Law Enforcement, Judicial, and Prison / incarceration: positions of power. Jeopardy questions: "What is the common articulated goal of 70's Charles Mason and 90's Tim McVeigh's crimes?"
Of course Thom Hartman viewers are familiar with the Coop attempt against FDR (many of the participants descended from the TR & HT busted trustee's. Unfortunately "Too big to jail & too big to fail" existence was in the 30's - 40's. Gen Smedley Butler's revelations was ignored by the majority of congress thus no significant punishments were meted and thus the underlying philosophy was left to proliferate over generations to metastasize and spread throughout the American body politic. The principles were left with their wealth and the according power that wealth imbues despite being directly involved in the seditious treason. Same as it ever was....
The US underwent a "HARD" coop in 1963 with the assassination of JFK by Organized Crime, aided and abetted by the CIA (Allen Dulles) and covered up by the FBI (J Edger Hoover). The Warren Commission was purposed to cover up the whole affair - interesting enough around the time of Nixon who himself was "mobbed up" as well as an actual traitor; committing high treason to sabotage peace talks between South Vietnam and North Vietnam.
The more pertinent Question "No decency" Joe McCarthy should have asked instead of "Have you now or ever been a Communist; was "are you now or ever been a fascist"? After all we did clandestine bring over our own NAZI "scientists" to America as well as our former OSS WW2 Organized Criminal 'Friends".
As David Brin said: "It's not so much that power corrupts as that power attracts the corruptible; the sane have other interests".
I was quick to like your post this morning, even before thoroughly reading it, because I’ve been asking myself this for a few years also. I began to wonder this during the protests following George Floyd being killed, as I watched the actions of many law enforcement against peaceful protesters. I confess, though I know the sentiments causing this tension on both sides, I was shocked to see the brutality used against protesters and journalists. Documented by local journalists, with scant if any coverage on MSM, this got my attention and was very alarming. It’s one thing to do your duty under a command; but what I witnessed at times was clearly rageful, self-righteous zealousness to crush the dissent. And doing it with anonymity, as opposed to doing it for public attention. This was much scarier than manipulation of the ‘cult of personality’ type; this was clearly action based on the assumption that they had the right to take charge.
Over a 30 year period I’ve watched this mentality change among a veteran population, as a psychologist and trauma specialist working closely with traumatized combat veterans. I did not understand what I was seeing, hearing and feeling change in many of them, or some of the police officers who had for years been good and trusted colleagues. But as Faux News blared out of almost every television, and most of us were just keeping our noses to the ground doing the hard work, there WERE nefarious players at work actively manipulating these good and honest people. Christian Nationalists and other white supremacists were deliberately lying to them, to inflame their passions about things that weren’t even happening and win them to their side. I used to assume that the “people at the top” were smarter than me and certainly knew truth from lies, could see that a yellow journalism effort like Faux news was just that, and would do something to help their young soldiers and staff from falling victim to the propaganda. For myself, I no longer believe those things. On Jan 7, 2021 I had a family member call me to ‘thank me’ for having tried to explain this to them: I barely registered what they meant. But for years I had been alarmed at what I felt and was seeing, and had apparently tried to describe it, though I didn’t understand it yet myself.
As always, thanks for this upsetting but important writing this morning, Thom. Its clarity, thoroughness, conciseness and provocativeness are signature to your good writing and thoughtfulness. I wish you could have put these good talents to more fun use, but for our country, I’m glad you’ve been using them as you have for all these years.
One if the many reasons I subscribe to your newsletter is that you have a way of tying pertinent details into a larger framework of events, so that plot points are not lost to the passage of time. I believe the chain of command on January 6 was part of the coup. How did I know? Some rando on Twitter? Because MAGA rhetoric all over social media said they were going to DC on January 6 (not Jan 1 or 14th) & often mentioned Jesus, 1776, the Storm,etc. There is no doubt in my mind that the bros Gens Flynn see themselves as “Patriot Christian Evangelics “ returning USA to God,in much the same style as Russia or Hungary, have done. Of course, there are members of the military & law enforcement who feel the same way about “faith, family, & 2A” and are absolutely willing to establish a harsh, repressed nation in order to achieve “gods glory”-the same promises made to isis terrorists.
Moreover, I’m not sure where Ginni & Clarence Thomas belong on the list of Jan 6 schemers, but it is crystal clear that they are “off limits” to press…for now. I hope that you & other highly sought after voices, will continue to dig into that duo. We only know the tip of the spear about the corruption on Scotus! Dig dig!
You are not alone. I have been viewing this 'quiet conspiracy' as likely since the start. During the following two years with the information drip, drip, drip, the odds of policing participation has only increased. Officers and military all wiping their records was my final straw. They were not simply accommodators - but had become active members of a massive cover-up.
RE: "Why are so few people openly speculating that corrupt individuals — possibly only a tiny handful — within the FBI, Secret Service, and Department of Defense may have participated in a plot led by Donald Trump to overthrow our government?"
Remember back after the Watergate break-in, there were only two reporters spending hours and dollars digging into what happened and even their co-workers initially didn't believe them. They were allowed to persist in spite of the cost.
And that was back before all the media consolidation and conversion of news deparments into entertainment profit centers. Don't forget what the CBS CEO said in 2016, 'DJT may be bad for American but he's great for he bottom line.' Don't forget that the Telecommunications Act of 1996 allowed this consolidation and ownership by oligarchs.
MSM is a big part of why this conspiracy is being ignored. Your show and FSTV exist because of the failure of MSM to inform. Back in 1986, after being fired by MSNBC for NOT supporting the WAR in Iraq, Jeff Cohen created FAIR.org, https://fair.org, to start documenting the new goal of MSM to misinform citizens directly and indirectly by NOT reporting some topics, like coup attempts by billionaires.
MSM is ignoring the conspiracy becuase they are part of it. MSM is ignoring the conspiracy because their oligarch owners are part of the conspiracy. MSM is ignoring the conspiracy because they don't want to reveal their co-conspirators in Congress and the Executive branch, or the billionaires who fund such conspiracies. Just as the funders/planners of the coup effort in 1933 of FDR were spared being held accountable, today's conspiracy funders will pay to stay free to finalize their coup of our democracy. They will placate us by reporting on the low level minions who were caught on video and are now being convicted of sedition.
Once again you have pointed out the obvious; at least to those of us who look at the whole picture and not just the frame. The change of the Secretary of Defense was a sure harbinger of the forthcoming trouble's. I truly believe-as you have written- that we were damn lucky. Meanwhile; we surly need to keep our eyes on the storm ahead. The headlines of two articles in RawStory today portend big trouble brewing. "Is this the new face of MAGA." "RNC taps right-wing extremists to lead group tasked to expand GOP appeal."
It is obvious what happened. What is dangerous is the lack of accountability.
Rachel Maddow's "Ultra" is equally frustrating. The Fourth Estate must investigate, because none in government seem to care.
Thank you, Thom, for putting together what we should never forget. Too often we become lost in today's battle, when the first one has never truly been called out for what it was - treason. How many coincidences benefiting those who smell of treason does it take to be called what it is? How many blatantly deliberate acts that furthered the violence of Jan. 6 does it take to see that Jan. 6 was our Fort Sumter. There were no dupes. Everyone in the room knew enough that they had to make a decision; become a working part of the machine, go along with it sans resistance and hope it didn't bite them too hard in the end, resign and stay out of it, or resign and tell the truth to people who can make it real for the rest of us.
Well said Thom!! I have been wondering for months now about the probability of a larger conspiracy. And I share your disbelief that much of what seems like quite obvious evidence of such, (The Christopher Miller memo), has not been brought up by the mainstream Press or even the January 6th Committee. I suspect the tendrils or this conspiracy reach far into the military and law enforcement agencies!
I’ll never forget how surreal it felt watching the insurrection unfold on Jan 6, but in the back of my mind was where the hell is the National Guard. And when they finally arrived, what the hell took so long. All throughout the Jan 6 committee hearings I kept wondering if they were ever going to talk about it, but there was nothing. Rightfully a lot of the focus was on the former president but almost nothing on the involvement of other members of the government. It’s as if it’s all the rest is being swept under the rug. How will we prevent this from happening again if we don’t know the full extent of what happened?
This is a conspiracy out in the open. Our federal and local police forces are not only infiltrated with confederates it is the very system they are a part of. While Thom you will no discuss defunding the police because Barack Obama and Democratic Party leadership mock this salient policy demand it is the only real way to protect us against a militarized and totalitarian occupying force. Instead political expediency has Biden boasting about "funding the police" and adding 100,000 more officers to the force. The response to BLM versus the response to confederate traitors says it all, and until we have voices that have a megaphone who are courageous enough to call for the proper public policy response, and that is defunding the police, this cancer of support for white supremacy and oppression of black and brown communities will only get worse.
Some excellent journalism here. As Brendan Brown said, keep digging; don't let this get buried. Googled where Chris Miller is now; he seems to want to keep a low profile; the "dog" doesn't want to feed this story. If no one else is held accountable, he needs to be - as the "acting" head of defence under Trump, he's got the info, and was responsible for all the missing evidence, the missing texts & emails.
You started this Report brilliantly - the Sherlock Holmes bit was perfect, and set the tone for the whole article. It could set the tone for the entire 1/6 investigation - What were those dogs up to??
I was very suspicious when tfg fired Mark Esper and installed Chris Miller along with several of his other lackeys in the Pentagon . I think it’s obvious there was a plan/conspiracy involving the Flynn brothers as well. I was suspicious then, especially when the letter to the National Guard was sent. I’m convinced now it was a seditious conspiracy involving the trump installed military “leaders”
Excellent article! This, should be Exhibit 1 every time it's a Democrat's turn at the mic in the 6,285, or so, investigations planned in the Republican House for the next two years...or longer, depending.
It's an unstoppable force meeting an immovable object -- a story too big to contain but also too big not to. The Democratic minority in a House divided has the most wonderful of opportunities to use the strength of their opponent to their own advantage, like in jiu-jitsu.
From Scott Spade (pen author). in the case of controversies, I like to think in terms of my "personal probability" of some proposed action or event like the scenario proposed here--widespread conspiracy (yes or no) in terms of the $$ that I would be willing to wager given "favorable" odds (based on my biased opinion). In the historic example of Jan 6, I assign the probability to "yes" to 90% because of the many data points provided by Thom and his reader comments. Let me just add to one more issue that seems to me to be under-reported, at least in the progressive media. What about all the federal officials/employees/politicians who were (or are) waiting on the sidelines to see which side is "winning." (let's call them Whimps). In particular, perhaps the Justice Department (especially the FBI), employs a number of Whimps, who expected (or still expect) awareness/importance the Jan 6 event to be quickly forgotten. Maybe the painfully slow response of the Justice Department between Jan 6 and 2022 was partly the result of semi-roadblocks instigated by these of the "wait and see" (Whimp) crowd, e.g., Christopher Wray. Hopefully, the modified investigation headed by the special council Jack Smith will place an appropriate information barrier between the "new" investigation and the "dirty hands" of the Whimps. My note of historical context: I once wrote a novel about the 1960's and 70's in which I imagined the transfer of fantastic information (from an insider/whistle blower) to a "hero" about things that were considered fantastic delusions at the time by the mainstream, but later turned out to be true: CIA/Mafia collaboration, the real story of Cuban missile crisis, widespread FBI/Hoover extra-legal actions, cover-ups on all and every levels, etc. History may not repeat itself exactly, but parallels to the 1930's and 40's or again in the 1960's and 70's make for compelling drama, unfortunately including the nightmares.
This is history just made. This would be a good encore film for Mr. Palast & company after 'Vigilante film'.
One word answer: YES, but not just at the 'highest levels' the rot is throughout the individual states as well as the federal government in its entirety. The government was never "infiltrated by communists", a deceased WW2 vet friend of mine once said after 911: "we won the battles of WW2 but lost the war against fascism, government and business has been almost completely infiltrated by fascists. This started way before f__kface #45; I propose that the plot to overthrow the US Democracy started all the way back to post reconstruction.
Certainly a straight line can be drawn from the Robber Barons busted trusts (T Roosevelt & H Taft) resentments bolstered by 'Birth of the Nation' Woodrow Wilson who cemented the "white supremacists" holdovers from the US Civil war. The White Supremacists (Christen Nationalists, Aryan Nation, NAZI, KKK, and the relatively new Oath Keepers and boogalo Boys) were and are still an open secret when I was in the Military in the 70's, just as much as the propensity for the 'bullies' of all stripes are attracted to Law Enforcement, Judicial, and Prison / incarceration: positions of power. Jeopardy questions: "What is the common articulated goal of 70's Charles Mason and 90's Tim McVeigh's crimes?"
Of course Thom Hartman viewers are familiar with the Coop attempt against FDR (many of the participants descended from the TR & HT busted trustee's. Unfortunately "Too big to jail & too big to fail" existence was in the 30's - 40's. Gen Smedley Butler's revelations was ignored by the majority of congress thus no significant punishments were meted and thus the underlying philosophy was left to proliferate over generations to metastasize and spread throughout the American body politic. The principles were left with their wealth and the according power that wealth imbues despite being directly involved in the seditious treason. Same as it ever was....
The US underwent a "HARD" coop in 1963 with the assassination of JFK by Organized Crime, aided and abetted by the CIA (Allen Dulles) and covered up by the FBI (J Edger Hoover). The Warren Commission was purposed to cover up the whole affair - interesting enough around the time of Nixon who himself was "mobbed up" as well as an actual traitor; committing high treason to sabotage peace talks between South Vietnam and North Vietnam.
The more pertinent Question "No decency" Joe McCarthy should have asked instead of "Have you now or ever been a Communist; was "are you now or ever been a fascist"? After all we did clandestine bring over our own NAZI "scientists" to America as well as our former OSS WW2 Organized Criminal 'Friends".
As David Brin said: "It's not so much that power corrupts as that power attracts the corruptible; the sane have other interests".